Barbarian (2022)

Ep 321, 2 Guys and a Chainsaw

Todd: Hello and welcome to another episode of Two Guys and a Chainsaw. I’m Todd.

Craig: And I’m Craig.

Todd: Well, this week we get a little more modern than we usually do. Once again, reviewing a movie that came out just this year. In fact, I think just these last couple months, right? Uhhuh, this is 2022’s Barbarian, which is getting a lot of buzz.

I think lately on the internet. It came out on HBO Max, but I think it was also released in the theaters for a little bit. Yeah. At least. So somewhere, right? But right now you can get it on, uh, HBO Max Streaming service, which is what, one of the 15 streaming services you subscribe to Craig? Yep. Is that right?

Mm-hmm. . All right. one just ain’t enough. It starts just long Bill Scars guard and, uh, a gal named, uh, Georgina Campbell, who I instantly recognized actually myself from her role in one of my all time favorite Black Mirror episodes called Amy. Have you, do you watch Black Mirror? I love Black Mirror, 

Craig: but I didn’t 

Todd: remember her.

I believe she was the one who was, uh, it was the two girls who kind of fall in love, but they’re, and then it 

Craig: turns out it’s like, Uh, VI or something. Yeah. 

Todd: Vr. Yeah. And they’re, they’re kind of dead in new bodies. Oh God. I love that series. Yeah, it’s great. I was really happy to see her in this because I hadn’t seen her in anything else, and I really loved her in that.

And I hadn’t seen Justin Long in a while, and I’ve always enjoyed Justin Long. Mm-hmm. , I think the first movie we did with him in it was Jeepers Creepers. Right. Uhhuh . Um, and he was quite good in that, um, yeah, at Central Character. He makes a surprise appearance in this movie for me because I didn’t look up anything about it.

You told me don’t read anything about this movie, Uhhuh. All I had seen was the buzz. I’m in these horror Facebook groups and things and people kept posting the poster and saying, oh my God, what do you guys think of this movie? Oh my God, this movie, what do you think? And I didn’t read any of that stuff, but I did make a mental note.

Oh, check this out. I think in our little duo here, I’m the one who is always constantly searching for older movies to do, and you’re the one who’s always constantly keeping tabs on what the newer ones are that are worthwhile. That’s why I tend to ignore him a little bit. So I didn’t even know Justin Long was in this movie until he pops in halfway through and I was like, oh, this is cool Justin Long.

So, uh, so anyway, like I said, uh, I hadn’t seen this movie before. I didn’t know anything about it. You proposed it and you said don’t read anything about it before you watch it. Uh, and so I was prepared for that kind of movie and I sat down and watched it last night for the first. How about you, Craig? Uh, what made you decide to do this proposing?

I 

Craig: don’t know. I mean, I, I guess you could say that I seek out, uh, the new things, but that’s just kind of, because I watch everything and so most, I’m, I’m, it’s not so much that I’m looking for something new. It’s, I’m looking for things that I haven’t seen fair enough. And so I was just, uh, as I used to flip through cable, now I just, you know, scroll through these streaming services and check out what they have available, Uhhuh.

And, uh, I went to HBO Max and it was there. I had never heard of it. I, I knew absolutely nothing about it. I saw that it was new. The description for the premise was a little bit vague, but sounded interesting. Basically, it just said, uh, you know, a woman arrives at her Airbnb to find that, uh, it’s already occupied.

And little does she know or something. I don’t know, , but it, it, I, I felt going in like. I knew what kind of movie it was gonna be. And then for the first half hour or so, I really enjoyed it because I was really enjoying the performances. Mm-hmm. and, and it was really it for the first half hour, it was what I thought it was going to be.

And I kept thinking, I know where this is going, I know where this is going. And, and it kept building towards what I, where I thought it was gonna go. And then out of nowhere, huge left turn that I didn’t see coming at all completely defied my expectations. , how could it, how could you, right. . Right. And that’s why I said don’t read anything about it.

Uh, because I think if you know too much about it, it’s not gonna be as fun. Yeah. So again, we always say, you know, if you’re listening to the podcast, you wanna see the movie, you should turn this off, watch the movie first, and, and then come back. Because I just, I watched it for the first time last week. We, we recorded last week and we were talking about what we should do for this week.

I told you about it and you were game. And so I told you not to watch it. So then this weekend I watched it again and it doesn’t have the kind of rewatch factor that some movies have. Um, because I, I knew what was coming so that, that shock value, that surprise value is gone upon a second viewing. It’s still a good movie.

I think that, um, it’s well made. I really like the performances a lot. I think that the cinematography and direction are, are really skillful. Oh yeah. So overall, I think it’s a really good movie and I, I highly recommend it, but if you can avoid reading anything about it or, or talking with people about it before you see it, I think you’re gonna have a more fun.

Yeah, 

Todd: I completely agree with you. I have to admit, like I, I just, I just thought it was an intense experience almost from the beginning to the end. But especially like you said, the first half hour this, um, is another one of those writer director movies, which are, are often interesting cuz there’s somebody’s singular vision here that they got to the screen, you know, so some indie writer director thing.

I, I’m always interested in seeing what they, what they have to come up with. And, uh, after watching it, I went in and I read about Zach Kreger Uhhuh, he’s an American actor director. He hasn’t done too much before this. He’s, he’s been acting in, uh, some TV series here and there. Nothing I’ve really noticed.

Mm-hmm. . But, uh, this is kind of his, I would say feature film debut. And, uh, it’s quite skillful in the direction. And when I went and I read about the background of him actually writing this, I. Super personally excited because he sat down and wrote this script as an exercise. Mm-hmm. , he wanted to write a 30 minute script after reading a book that I love and read years ago, um, called The Gift of Fear by Gavin de Becker.

This is a book that, um, actually my wife read first the minute she read it. She said, Todd, you need to read this book. This book explains everything about how women feel. So, so I was like, okay, sure. I’ll read it. And I read it and I was just blown away. Just real briefly, Gavin de Becker is a guy who himself was.

A product of a pretty abusive household. And as he grew up, he found his calling in helping people deal with their problems with others, like basically stalker type situations, things like that. And he has an agency where he essentially helps celebrities and big name people deal with the attention they get the, the, the mail.

You know, they, they open their mail for them and, and, and sort through it. They, huh. Um, help screen some of their phone calls for them. And then when this person has an. Like somebody is stalking them, some crazy fan situation. Then they analyze like, is this something we really need to worry about? Who could this possibly be?

And uh, is it somebody close enough to you? And, and all that. And so he, his agency specializes in this and he wrote this book called The Gift of Fear. And it’s fantastic. And I feel like if every person in the world read this book, women, but also Men, , uh, who were open minded, they would have a better understanding of how to be better people.

And the long story short is the premise of the book is that fear is a gift that our body gives us. When you walk down a dark alley or you go into some crowded situation or something, wherever you are, if you’re starting to feel uncom, There’s a reason for that. Your body knows it before you do. Your brain, uh, is attuned to what could possibly be wrong.

What is different about this situation and what is uneasy about it before you recognize it consciously? So he says, you need to pay attention to that, and you need to. Act on it or else you will find yourself in trouble. And he says, one of the reasons why women find themselves in bad situations so often is because they are often taught as young girls not to be rude mm-hmm.

to be polite and to suppress these feelings. And so women will find themselves walking down a street and there’ll be some guy crossing on the other side that they just feel weird about, but they will go, oh, it’s nothing. It’s nothing. It’s fine. And it will turn out to be that guy. Or more to the point of the book than the practical advice as well, is that, uh, usually when he talks to these people and says, all right, you got this guy stalking you.

It’s getting creepy, it’s getting scary. Who do you think it could be? That person will go through like a list of folks, and then at the end of the list he’ll be like, all right, is there anybody else? And they’ll be like, well, you know, it’s probably not this guy because blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, but I don’t know.

It’s possible it could be him. And he’s like, It’s usually him, . It’s the one that person has recognized it’s problematic, but they have over time just talked it away, you know, tried to convince themselves he’s not. And so the reason why men should read this book is he goes into great detail about how men make women uncomfortable by preying on them, even when they think they’re not uhhuh

Or even when, you know, it’s just like, oh, come on, honey, I’m just teasing with you. Whatever men’s greatest fear is that they’re going to be embarrassed uhhuh by some situation. And women’s greatest fear is that they’re gonna get killed Uhhuh. And that. Has stuck with me that quote from that book. And, and B my wife pointed to that and said, this is absolutely true.

And it changed me a little bit. I mean, I’m, I’ve not been that kind of guy, right? Right. I think I’ve always been pretty polite, but I’m always hypersensitive and hyper careful, but never letting myself or anybody in my orbit make anyone feel uncomfortable in that way. Even if they think they’re joking, even if they think they’re laughing.

It’s pretty obvious that sometimes that goes a little beyond what that person thinks and then they get fearful. And so anyway, he read this book and he sat down, uh, to write a 30 minute short. Where a woman finds herself in a situation where she just starts ignoring all of the red flags and gets herself into trouble.

And that’s kind of how it starts out. But then as you say it, it takes a turn. 

Craig: Yeah. It’s, it’s ki it’s kind of a strange coincidence that we’re doing this just a couple of weeks after we did that little Red writing Hood movie in the Company of Wolves. It, it, I feel like it addresses kind of the same concern.

You’re right. Um, and also, I, I just watched another movie this weekend and I, I posted kind of a discussion about it on our Patreon page, but another movie called Run Sweetheart Run, which is very much the same thing. It’s about women kind of ignoring some red flags, because in many ways, you know, men are, they, they seem safe, they seem charming, and, and from an outside perspective, Like, we’ll get to talking about this movie in just a second, but this, the scenario that this young woman finds herself in.

It could be perfectly safe, but it could not. Mm-hmm. and, and yeah. And as a viewer, as an outside you, you can tell based on her performance that she’s hesitant and reluctant as she should be. Yes. But, uh, you know, from, as, from an. Perspective. I was very tense in those moments. I was just gonna say, you know, it’s, it’s sad that that’s the way that things are, that women have to be so on guard all the time.

Yeah. And, and also that men have to, or, or should try to be aware of that and, and do their best to make, uh, people comfortable. And I say it’s sad, but that’s just the state of things. And I do think that we as men have a responsibility to be aware of ourselves and how our actions, uh, can be perceived.

Even I a gay man, uh, a few weeks ago I went to the grocery store and it was one of those stores where you have to have a quarter to get to unlock a shopping cart. Mm-hmm. and I didn’t have a quarter, I had 25 cents. I had two dimes and a nickel, but I didn’t have a quarter. And there were two young women, I assume probably college age women, uh, shopping together, unloading their cart in the parking lot.

And this was broad daylight. And I went to. Ask them if I could give them my 25 cents in exchange for their cart. But even as I approached them, I was thinking this could make them uncomfortable. Hmm. A strange man approaching them in a public place. And when I said something, I said, excuse me, or excuse me, miss, or something, they turned around and looked at me and I could tell that just for a split second, they were on guard.

Hmm. Um, I don’t know this man. I don’t know what he wants. Um, and then of course they were polite and gave me their cart and I gave them 25 cents and we all moved on with our lives. But even in just innocent, simple moments like that, I think women have to be very much aware of their surroundings. And, uh, it, it’s, it’s unfortunate, but it is the.

Of the world because there are dangerous predatory people, not just men, but, uh, yeah, there are dangerous predatory men out there. And, and I think that that’s what the, the first part of the movie deals with. You know, it starts out, uh, it’s a rainy night. Um, this young woman, beautiful woman, Tess, played by Georgina Campbell, as you already said, pulls up to the outside of it’s nighttime.

Uh, a small house looks like a small suburban house with a, you know, a small front lawn. Looks like a, a fairly nice place. And she checks, um, her email for her Airbnb confirmation information. And, and she has like a, a code for a lockbox that the key will be inside. And she struggles with it. She, she memorized the number wrong for a second.

Eventually she gets it open and there’s no key in there. And she calls the, uh, property manager, but she just gets a voicemail. So she goes and she’s sitting in her car trying to figure out what to do when she sees a light on in the house. So she goes back up to the house and, uh, knocks on the door and this man opens the door and it’s Bill Scars guard and Bill Scars guard, you know, played Pennywise in the new IT movies.

Uh mm-hmm. . He, but he’s done a lot of things. You know, he’s, he’s launching what appears to be a very successful career and he’s tall and he’s handsome, but he’s also kind of, I mean, he played Pennywise for Pete’s sake. He’s got kind of a minute. I don’t know. There’s just, there’s something about his face.

Yeah, there’s something about his face that could potentially be a little bit, uh, frightening. But he opens the door. It seems like she’s awakened him from sleep. He’s kind of groggy. Yeah. I’m sorry. Who are you? Who are you? This is 40 76 Barbery, right? I don’t know. Yeah. Yeah, I think so. You don’t know. No, I don’t live here.

I’m renting this place. It’s the middle of the night. I don’t have it the top of my head. The 

Todd: address? No, I’m renting this place. What? 

Craig: I I’m running this place. I, I, I booked it on Airbnb like a month ago. I booked it on 

Todd: HomeAway. You’re fucking kidding. 

Craig: Wait, wait, wait. Are you sure you have the right place?

Yeah. My email says 4 76 Barbara, that’s here. Right. And my code works for the lock box. I’m supposed to be in here. 

Todd: Did you try and call someone? 

Craig: Yeah. No one answered. And you sure you have the right date? Look, yeah. I mean, it looks right. This is unbelievable. What am we supposed to do? I dunno. I dunno. Why don’t you, why don’t you come inside and we’ll call these idiots?

And right from the beginning, red flags are going off in my mind. Don’t go in there. Yeah. Mm-hmm. . You don’t know who this guy is. You’re alone. It’s ni it’s the middle of the night. Um, he could be anybody. He could be a squatter. He, you know, anybody, for whatever reason, she decides to go in and then, Kind of everything seems to line up.

She checks his confirmation information and it looks legit. They booked through different agencies. Mm-hmm. , but his stuff looks legit. He, he’s being 

Todd: nice. She runs into his, um, his, his wallet while she’s in his room. His name is what it says it is, and what he said it was. And, and also, uh, it’s really cool because she’s locking the door every room she goes into.

She’s obviously being cautious, right. Even as she’s doing this stuff. And it’s, the camera’s very clear. I mean, actually I really like the, um, I really like the cinematography in this movie. It’s very punchy. It very much wants to direct our attention very quickly to things that we need to uhhuh. It doesn’t zoom, but it’s got these fast dolly shots sometimes.

And these quick closeups. I saw it described, I think, by the director himself that. That upstairs, it’s uh, it’s like a David Fincher movie and downstairs it’s Rammy. . Yeah. There’s a very different, um, very distinct, different visual style between, uh, when the movie kind of starts to go into darker territory in a different place than here.

But here it’s very, I mean, and I think that itself ratchets up the tension. Like, oh, she locked the door. That’s important. Oh boy, , you know, uh, all of these things, uh, really add up to. Increase the tension as we walk with her through this and think, uh, like you said, like what, what would we do in the circumstance?

Uhhuh. maybe don’t do that. Oh, he might be okay, but, okay, good. At least you locked the door. All right, fine. Oh, he checks out on, alright. And maybe he’s not lying then He’s being sweet to her. You know, he offers to make her tea, but she doesn’t drink the tea. And that’s, you know, the first thing in a horror movie, don’t drink the tea.

Right, right. She doesn’t drink the tea. But then later he notices she didn’t drink the tea and says to her, there’s a bottle of wine here. I want to have a drink and if you wanna drink it with me, I noticed you didn’t open the tea, so I was gonna open it in front of you just so you were more comfortable.

You know, he’s being deferential. He knows and understands and he’s trying his best to make her feel comfortable, 

Craig: which is unnerving. 

Todd: You know? It is unnerving. Is it, is it a nice I’m move or is. You know, master manipulator move. 

Craig: Exactly. Even in that moment with the tea and the wine, I’m like, did he tamper with the wine somehow without her know, like, I’m questioning all of these things and that, cuz that’s what I’m expecting to happen.

Because, and, and I think that, um, bill Scars guard is just, I, I think he’s a really good actor and, uh, he does such a good job here not only of being charming, but of being aware. He, he understands that she’s nervous and uncomfortable. They talk about it. Yeah. He, they talk about how, he said that he wouldn’t know what to do if he were in her shoes and she said, oh, you would’ve just walked right in here.

And he said, you just walked right in here . But like, they’re, they’re both very aware of the dynamic and, and we are aware of the dynamic. Yes. He seems very mild mannered and charming. , but if you were trying to manipulate somebody, isn’t that what you would do? Like, you wouldn’t be aggressive from the get go.

And I mean, he does, he really comes across as very kind and warm and charming and, and he’s helpful. He, it’s raining. He goes out in the rain and he gets her luggage and he, he does offer to make her tea and he does consider that she might be wary of accepting a drink from a strange man. So he waits to open the wine until she can be present.

But the whole time, I’m thinking, yeah, that’s, they’re setting her up, you know, to be, to get comfortable so that. Later he can pounce and make his move. And then he’s going to become very sinister. Because I’m also very aware of the fact that the dude’s almost seven feet tall. Like he’s a huge guy, , he’s lean, but he’s big.

If he wanted to, he could easily physically overpower her. And that is where I thought the movie was going without question. I was just waiting for it to happen. Me 

Todd: too. And, and, and, uh, eventually she lets her guard down because she is there in town. This is Detroit, by the way. And she’s there in town to investigate the local music scene for a document.

Well, she’s interviewing for a, a position with a documentary filmmaker who does these documentaries about the local music scene. He says, oh, well, you should interview me then. And she’s like, why? And he’s like, well, I’m one of. Co-founding members of some collective, uh, music collective. And she’s like that one.

It’s like, oh yeah. And it turns out that he’s legitimately seen the, this sort of obscure, indie movie that, uh, this director had produced before. And so all of that is clearly coincidence. You know, there’s just no way he could know these things without being genuine about it. And so once that’s clear to her, it not only does her guard let down, but she’s kind of charmed by him,

Craig: And these two actors have really good chemistry together. I mean, this, it, at that point when she kind of lets her guard down, it feels kind of like a meet cute from a romcom, right? Like they Exactly. They really hit it off. And, uh, everything seems fine. He’s shivel risk. He offers to sleep on the couch and, and she sleeps, um, in the bedroom.

In the middle of the night, she hears the noise and she looks in the door. Her door, her bedroom door is open, and it had been closed when she had gone to sleep. So she kind of gets up, she calls his name quietly and doesn’t hear anything. She gets up, and then as she approaches the living room, she starts to hear these odd noises, and it’s him on the couch making weird noises.

It appears that he’s having a night. And, and she’s kind of nervous and she nervously touches him and he startles awake and, what are 

Todd: you doing, ? Yeah. And, and 

Craig: she says, I think you were having a nightmare. And she asked, did you open my door? And he’s like, no, . I mean, I, I just think he’s really good. He plays that kind of startled awake, groggy, like, leave me alone.

Yeah. Kind of thing. Really, really well. And then, you know, they just go back to sleep and, uh, when she gets up in the morning, he’s gone. He left her a nice note saying, you know, I have stuff to do today or whatever, but I hope to see you tonight. I had a really good night last night, and I’m thinking, wow, this, this guy’s good.

You know, like he’s luring her into this thing where she thinks that they’ve kind of got a relationship. You know, if he was gonna do something, he surely would’ve already done it. You know, he wouldn’t have given her the opportunity to flee during the day, but he did. And so, She goes outside to go to her, uh, job interview.

And that’s when you realize for the first time that although the house that they’re staying in seems very nice, it’s smack in the middle of what looks like a completely abandoned and rundown neighborhood. Like, it’s scary. A bad, bad part of town. Like the homes don’t even look like they’re occupied. Or if they are occupied, it’s probably just by derelicts or squatters.

Yeah. Anyway, she goes to her interview, it’s fine. The interview goes well, but the interviewer asks her where she’s staying and when, um, te tells her where she’s staying. The interviewer is like, what? Yeah. You know it , are you getting Well, I, I mean, yeah, it seems a little rough, but No, you shouldn’t be there.

What do you mean that’s not an Airbnb in Brightmore? Yeah, I mean, like, it’s a cute little house, but. Yeah, I suppose the neighborhood is a little intense. Well, I did try and find somewhere else, but, uh, there’s like a convention in town or something and I, I, I have a roommate, so it’s a, it’s a little complicated, I guess.

Okay. We’ll just be careful. Okay. So when she goes back, as she gets out of her car, we see in the distance somebody in the background running towards her and she eventually notices too. And it’s a homeless man who’s running and shouting at her, um, and almost reaches her just as she gets into the door.

And then he bangs on the door and says, you gotta get outta that house. You shouldn’t be in that house. And then he goes away. And this is when things started to get more directly scary. But I still felt like I knew where it was going. Mm-hmm. , you know what I mean? 

Todd: Yep. Uh, yeah. Does he come home at this point or 

Craig: she’s still poking around?

She’s poking around because she, she needs to, she needs toilet paper or something. That’s right. And so she’s looking around for toilet paper. There’s a door that leads down into a basement and she goes down there and she finds toilet paper. But in the time that she’s down there, the door swings closed and locks from the outside.

Yeah. And so she can’t get out. That’s when she start, I mean, what else are you gonna do? She doesn’t have her cell phone. 

Todd: She also has the key on her to the apartment, which she should have left in the lockbox for the guy. Yeah. So even she’s like, oh, you know, crap. Like when this guy comes home, he’s not even gonna be able to come in.

And how she gonna be able to signal that she’s trapped in the basement? So it’s, it’s, you know, it’s a pretty weird situation. That door, by the way, has been creaking closed. And open a little bit, you know, if you catch it in the background during the, earlier, some of the earlier scenes, especially at night when she woke up.

So it, it does also, you know, there’s a little bit of a supernatural ish feeling there perhaps. And, uh, while she’s probing around downstairs, um, she hears a noise coming from behind a wall. And when she turns around and kind of looks at the Walmart, she looks on the shelf and sees that there is a hole in the wall with a rope sticking out of it.

And she pulls on that rope and a hidden door swings. And it leads into this sort of dark tunnel. And she, at, at, yeah, at first she says, Nope. . Nope. Yeah, that was so brilliant. She’s saying what we’re thinking. Nope. . But, but then, I don’t know, curiosity gets the better of her and, uh, you know, there’s no light in there.

So she props up a mirror, which is kind of smart, uh, to shine a light from the ceiling down the hallway so that she can get down there a little bit. And she sees it’s a rather short hallway, but there is definitely another room or a door on the side. So she walks in and, uh, sure enough, when she makes this little left in this hallway, uh, there is a room and it’s creepy.

Yeah. It’s a bed with a bucket on the floor and a video camera set up in the corner. 

Craig: Yeah. And it like, and it, it looks. She says later, I think it looks like a dungeon and it does. I mean, we say a bed, but it’s just a dirty, disgusting mattress on a, yeah, on like a metal frame. And then the bucket looks disgusting and, and a video camera set up pointed right at the bed, like, yeah, this is 

Todd: bad.

This is not cool. I mean, you’re thinking all sorts of things. Obviously, torture, horror, movies, stuff like that. Also, you know, I keep thinking about real life stuff. Like, it was a year, I don’t know, probably 10 years ago or eight years ago, where suddenly we were finding little suburban neighborhood guys who were keeping women locked up in their basement for decades, uh, for decades, you know, and, and so you’re thinking, oh God, is this a remnants of that?

Is this still going on? Is. That guy, somehow he’s got something set up down there. It’s really, the movie starts to take a com, almost a complete left turn. Not completely. Cuz you’re still wondering, maybe it’s this guy. Oh gosh. I, 

Craig: I, I thought it’s him. I, I, I thought it’s him. It’s, he’s a bad guy. And, uh, so she kind gets out of there and, and bangs on the window because Right.

Cuz he’s there. He showed up and he, uh, gets the window open and she gives him the key. He comes in, he gets her out of the basement and she’s freaking out as she should be. He’s trying to calm her down and asking her what she found and she tells him and he’s like, well, wait, don’t leave. Let’s, let’s figure this out.

Uh, and he even says, look, I’m sorry that I’m not panicking because of what you saw, but I haven’t seen it. Yeah. I need to see it. He, you know, he, he says something like, So you found a room with an old bed and a bucket. It’s a basement. There’s all kinds of crap down there, which could logically be true, but yeah, the, the truth is he hasn’t seen it.

If he were to see it, he would be just as freaked out as she was. Yeah. And in this moment, you know, he’s trying to get her to stay. He even kind of physically blocks her from getting out. Um, even though he’s still being very gentle and and comforting, um, I’m thinking, you need to get out of there. Don’t trust this guy cuz he says, just let me, let me go check it out and then we can leave.

And so he goes down there and he’s down there for a little while and then she goes to the door, uh, of the stairway and calls down to him and he doesn’t answer. 

Todd: Well, at first he does. At first she says, are you, are you there? And he’s like, yeah, there’s, there’s like a very faint Yeah. Uh, Uh, but then she waits a little longer and yells a few more times.

And you’re right, he doesn’t answer. So, and I’m 

Craig: thinking, don’t go down there. Yeah. Like, this is a, this is so obviously a trap. Um, he’s down there waiting for you. The second you get down there, he’s gonna grab you and lock you in that room, and then we’re gonna have to watch you be tortured for the rest of this movie.

Right. . But she does go down. She almost locks herself in there again, but catches it at the last minute and props you. Yeah. 

Todd: That was a good moment. I , I like these little moments in this movie. This movie was good with these kinds of moments, uh, where just kind of subverts your expectations a little bit.

Like, oh, they’re, she’s gonna get trapped down there again. Oh no, actually, she’s smart. She ran up there in time and this, you know, this 

Craig: happens. She moves slowly. So the tension is building, you know. Oh yeah. It’s a very, very, it’s not like she’s running around, you know, she’s very slowly moving, looking around for him.

She fi she goes to the room, he’s not in there. She steps back out into that dark, creepy hallway and kind of looks around and realizes that. On the other end of the hallway, there’s another door that sh neither she nor we had previously 

Todd: noticed. Yeah. It’s even more hidden. It’s like at the end 

Craig: of the wall.

Yeah. And when she go, she opens that door, it leads to more stairs going even further down into what? I don’t know. I did not know what to expect. Like 

Todd: mine at this point you’re like, oh God, all bets are off. We have no idea. And he’s now faintly yelling, help help me. 

Craig: Uhhuh. Very faintly like it sounds like he’s, oh man.

Hundreds yards away. Like, yeah, where is he? Um, and she goes down there and it appears to be like this system of tunnels and she sees like large dog crates down there. It’s all very scary. . 

Todd: Yeah. And at the same time you’re thinking this woman is a good person. And she should run out. But also maybe this guy really is in trouble.

You know, Uhhuh, you can tell like she wants to help him. She’s not the kind of person who’s gonna leave somebody behind, especially when she’s the one who sent him in, you know, more or less uhhuh. So there’s gotta be a little, a certain level of guilt there as well. 

Craig: It’s really dark and she only has the flashlight on her cell phone.

And yeah, eventually he kind of pops out of the dark. Um, and it for a split second, I didn’t know, I still was thinking he’s gonna grab her. Mm-hmm. . Um, but he doesn’t, he just says, we have to get outta here. We have to get outta here. And she’s like, what? What’s going on? And he says, there’s somebody else down here.

And, and he’s whispering and he’s obviously scared. Why did you come down here? Someone else is, why, why did you come down here? Someone else is dony. What is someone bit me, . Okay. Wait, we need, we ain’t to go. Didn’t need to. No, no, no, no. Don’t go there. That’s where they were. That’s where they were. No, let’s go.

That’s the way out. That’s, that’s way. Come, come here, we stop it. I, no, that’s stop it. We have to come this way. That’s, we have to come this way. What’s down? Don’t just, I’m not going back. When Out of the darkness, behind him comes this lumbering naked person, um, with long, stringy black hair. Uh, and, uh, it happens really fast and it’s dark and you can’t really see what’s going on.

But whoever this person is, grabs Keith by the head and just smashes his head against the wall, like, just totally destroys his head 

Todd: repeatedly. Oh, it’s gross. 

Craig: And, and boom. Cut to bright, sunny daylight along. The coastal 

Todd: Highway. Oh, , what a jarring scene. I, I have to admit, I was really happy for the let up intention.

I, I had been on the edge of my seat for a good 15 minutes, you know, before this Uhhuh , if, if not to some extent, the whole movie before this really. And so I was very grateful for this bright, sunny. Okay. Oh, all right. We got something else going on here, but also completely puzzled. They just brought this new guy in outta nowhere, completely new scene, driving on, obviously not in Detroit, and it’s Justin Long Uhhuh, 

Craig: and he’s singing and having a good time.

Like Yeah, I was so, I was so shocked. I, I, for a couple of reasons. One, I thought Keith was gonna be the bad guy. I was positive. And then two, I never would’ve. That he would’ve gotten killed off. Yeah. 30, 40 minutes into the movie. He’s a big movie star. I figured, you know, he’s the star of this movie, or at least one of the stars of the movie.

And here he is brutally killed within the first half hour. I was so shocked. Yeah. And then for it to cut to this bright scene with Justin Long, who just seems like a very charming person Yeah. Uh, in real life. And that reads on the screen and everything that he does. Mm-hmm. . And so here we are with fun.

Justin Long driving in a convertible along the coast singing his head off. I had no idea what was happening at that point. And I loved it. I loved that my expectations had been subverted and I was really excited to see what was gonna happen next. Yeah, me 

Todd: too. And how does this relate? Right. And also, like you said, Also I, I love Justin Long, not just does he come across really well in movies and he’s fun to look at and he’s interesting guy, but he comes across as really nice just as a person down to earth.

Yeah. If you read interviews with him, he’s fairly scandal free. Seems very sensitive. And I mean, think, I’m gonna knock it on wood here. , you know, , who knows in this day and age. But yeah, he just, he’s just fun. And so I thought, oh man, this movie is gonna, is gonna get even more fun. I was totally taken by this point.

And as he’s driving on the highway, he’s chatting on the cell phone with, I guess his agent. It turns out he’s an actor or something. Uhhuh, there’s a problem with an upcoming project and there’s two people on the line and they’re delivering bad news to him that not only has he been pulled off of this project, but there are going to be allegations of sexual harass.

Towards him, and you can just see it. He, he’s stunned. He doesn’t know what to say for a little while. You see things are turning in his head. And of course I’m thinking, did he do it, did he not? Maybe he did, you know, like it instant drama and intrigue coming with this brand new character that we’ve seen for five minutes.

Craig: Well, and it’s, it seems like his, I, I’m guessing that it’s probably his agent and his lawyer. Yeah. And, uh, they, they kind. Try to ease him into it. But then when he gets, cuz he’s mad. I, I, I was the first to be attached to that. She came on after me. Okay. I recommended her aj, I think honestly, you just need to call that.

I think we should tell him the other thing. No, I think right now he just needs to cool down. What other, what other, it’s not important. Aj, you just have to relax. No, no, no, no, no. Fuck that. What other, what else? There’s gonna be a story tomorrow in the Hollywood Reporter about this. About what? About me? Are you kidding?

The allegations are very serious. Yo, what she’s saying I did. Is she saying I raped her or something? Aj, why don’t you just calm down? No. What the fuck? What is she saying? Yes, she’s saying that you raped her. Hey Jerry, you there? I gotta call you back. And pulls over to the side of the road and Yes. I’m wondering did he do it too?

I think that this is brilliant casting. The director offered the role to Zach Efron, which I also think would be an interesting choice, but I think that this is even better because we are so used to Justin Long, long being a good guy, a nice guy, a sweet guy. And it seems that, that from the time that we meet him, he seems very charming.

Mm-hmm. . And so then of course you’re questioning yourself, uh, you know, did he do it? He meets with his financial advisor who basically tells him that within a couple of months if he can’t find work, he’s, he’s gonna be penniless. And he says, you’ve, you know, you’ve got those properties in Michigan. Uh, he says, I could sell those.

And the guy’s like, well, yeah, you could, but it’s not like those are really hot properties that might buy you a few more months, but that’s it. Oh, and buy the way. I’m dropping you too. Like I, I think that this is very true, uh, of today. Yeah. When serious allegations like that are lobbied against, uh, a person, people want to distance themselves.

Yeah. They don’t, they don’t wanna have anything to do with somebody who could potentially be caught up in something bad. 

Todd: I mean, you have no help, you know, , right. You’re really on your own in these circumstances. And so he 

Craig: fl uh, he flies to, uh, Detroit, which his lawyer says is a terrible idea. And Justin Long says I’m not under arrest.

He’s like, I’m not fleeing. I’m just, uh, you know, I’m coming here to do business to do some liquidation. He’s like, am I going to be arrested? And his lawyer’s like, It’s definitely a possibility, . And he says, you know, let, let me just call this woman and, and clear things up. And the lawyer says, under no circumstances will you call this woman.

Oh. Um, and so then he, you know, he’s in Detroit. He’s going, he’s gonna liquidate one of his properties. He drives there. And of course, It’s the house. Yeah. From the first part of the movie. Uh, and both Keith and Tessa’s cars are still parked in front, which you would think would kind of tip him off because they’re completely out of place.

and they’re parked directly in front of his house. Yeah. But he goes up and I, I think the door is unlocked, like he checks, uh, for the key, but it’s not there. And I think the door’s unlocked cuz he just goes in and he kind of makes himself comfortable, but it doesn’t take long before he realizes that there’s something up.

He notices that the basement door is propped and then he finds luggage. He finds their 

Todd: luggage and it’s great too. He’s like, what the hell? Like, he’s got a great attitude and affect. He’s just, he’s acting like a normal. Person, like this guy would be in the movie. I think he, he just plays us so well. You know, I saw an interview with him and he talked about playing this role.

You should look it up online. It’s, it’s really cool. And one of the things he says is, you know, he says, I’m not really a method actor. I’m not a guy who just can just jump into a role. He says, I’ve heard stories of Leonard DiCaprio, how he can be playing a video game and then press pause and then jump in and do this amazing scene in character and then just come back to his video game and start playing it again.

He is like, I’m not that guy. So, uh, but he is so good as an actor and he can, he feels so natural in this role and, uh, you’re thinking, okay, what is he gonna find this stuff downstairs? Does he know about this? I can’t remember if it’s now or later. No, it’s, it’s now that he goes out, right. Hangs 

Craig: out. Yeah.

Well, he talks to his mom on the phone and, uh, you know, he’s talking to his mom saying, you know, she’s a lying bitch. And the mom’s like, oh, you shouldn’t really talk like that, whatever. But it, it, I feel like it just kind of starts to expose more of his true nature. But then when he goes out, yeah, a friend calls him and he goes out and they meet at a bar, and the first thing the friend asks him is, did you do it?

Mm-hmm. . And his response. Oh man. It, it’s just so, it’s so weird coming from Justin Long. I’ll be real with you. That’s all I’m asking. Yeah. That’s only, let me be real with you. We did Okay. Right. She just took some convincing off. That’s it. Okay. But what the does that mean though? Like, I mean, was she like, did she say No?

I mean like, no, stop at first, but like, I wasn’t like, come here bitch, I’m gonna rape you. I was like, in the beginning she was like, no, whatever. But like, then we started fooling around more and then she was down like freaking really pound, I’m a persistent dude. Right. I’m like, I had a tiger. Yeah. You know, and she came around and that’s it.

That, that’s what happened. Straight up. It sounds really fishy. 

Todd: It’s so shady what everything he’s saying, you’re like, oh God, he did it. Yeah, he totally did it. Did it? Mm-hmm. . So then that an, that question is answered and I’m thinking, you know, in my kind of movie analytical mode, I’m thinking, okay, this guy’s gonna get it too.

Because now they’re setting him up as an unsympathetic character. Uhhuh , 

Craig: when he gets home from the bar, he does call the girl. Of course she doesn’t answer, but he leaves a drunken message just saying he’s sorry. And if he did anything that offended her, he is sorry. And that’s, and he’d love the opportunity to apologize actually to her, not just a recording.

And what he’s saying that that’s another thing that makes it so unsettling because he sounds. Sincere in that, you know, he thinks that he may have pushed a little too far and offended her, dude, you raped her. Like, that’s not, yeah. Something that you’re offended by. But I, I feel like that’s just a really, it, it, it shows his character.

Like he really didn’t think it was that big a deal. But you can see 

Todd: like the, the remorse, right. And I don’t, 

Craig: I don’t think so at all. I think that he’s just, I just think that he’s upset that he’s in 

Todd: trouble. He’s caught. Yeah. Yeah. That could be. Yeah, it could be. Yeah. I mean, I don’t know. I felt like there was a little bit more of like this guy, and look, it’s no excuse, absolutely no excuse, but I thought that there was just a hint of, of genuine, perhaps unaware in him.

Like he’s trying to talk himself outta something. He kind of knows, he. Okay. And you know what? I’m not gonna make excuses 

Craig: for this guy. I’m sorry. Yeah, I didn’t find him. I did not find him sympathetic at all. At that point. I’m like, this is a bad dude. And he’s pro, yeah, he’s probably done it before and gotten away with it and that’s why he didn’t think it was any big deal.

Todd: What happens next, I think is quite hilarious, and again, paints his character in a different light. He, he comes home back to the place and he’s gonna be putting this up on the market to raise money for his legal offense. And so he goes downstairs, he discovers this, um, 

Craig: Little room 

Todd: dungeon. Yeah, the dungeon.

Yeah. And he’s not, you think, oh God, well, he’s gonna be disturbed by this too. He goes back upstairs and the first thing he does is Google, do his basement, uh, square footage, add to total square footage of the house. , right. . He’s oblivious to the fact that he’s got this creepy dungeon in this basement, and he immediately goes down and starts measuring it.

Mm-hmm. the tape, measure gleefully measuring it like, oh man, I’m gonna get more money out of this. Then he finds that other door and he sees that creepy thing downstairs. I’m thinking, okay, well, surely he’s disturbed by this. No. He takes the tape measure to the top of the stairs and is measuring down the stairs, down the hallway.

It’s really funny. . 

Craig: It is funny, and like he, he kind of gives things sideways glances like, Hmm, that’s weird. He’s, he’s definitely more concerned about square footage, until way down the hall. There’s light coming out of a, like a room and he goes down there and there’s like fabric on the floor and there’s a TV.

That’s on and running a video of a woman like, like instructional video for teaching women how to breastfeed. Yes. Super weird. Mm-hmm. . And then as he’s standing there looking at that something or someone grabs his tape measure and yanks it out of his hand. And so he has a, he brought a knife cuz he had heard noises down there, but apparently he wasn’t particularly concerned.

So he is got a knife and he’s got his flashlight. Does the woman just come charging at him? I think she 

Todd: does, right? Yeah, she does. Yeah. She comes charging at him and he, he starts running, he’s like running in one direction. He’s kind of comes to a dead end. He runs another direction. Eventually the woman kind of pounces on him and he falls into a pit and this thing closes over him and suddenly out of the darkness comes Tess.

She’s down there, she’s like, So now we know Tess is alive, uh, and she’s captured by this creature and he’s down there too, and they’re both confused 

Craig: and she’s just this big naked feral. Woman. Yes. Um, she’s kind of got like a, a little bit of, um, wrong turn or hills have eyes kind of disfigurement of her 

Todd: face kind 

Craig: of thing.

Yeah. She, she’s, uh, vocal but nonverbal and she, Tess is trying. She’s like, you have to calm down because if you freak out, she’s gonna freak out. And I’m thinking, how long has she been down there? Like, ? What is the timeframe here? As it turns out, she doesn’t even know how long she’s been down there.

Certainly days, if not. I think when he, when he called his property manager, because he thought maybe somebody was renting the property manager’s like, no, we haven’t had anybody rent that for like two weeks. So I think Tess has been down there for a couple of weeks. The woman lowers through the grate at the top of this pit, a baby bottle, and it’s disgusting.

It’s got her hair all over it and she’s lowering it to AJ and Tess’s like, just drink it. Just drink it. . But he won’t. And so she gives it to Tess, and Tess does drink it. Ugh. But because Justin Long refuses, she opens up the, the woman opens up the great jumps down there and grabs him, pulls him out, and, and, and takes, takes him back to her room.

Well, of course, Tess wisely takes the opportunity to get the heck out of there. Mm-hmm. . And, and so she’s headed toward, The house. Uh, but she passes by the room that she’s billed as the mother, so I’m just gonna start calling her that. Yeah. Um, where the mother has Justin Long in there and is forcing him to breastfeed.

Oh. Off of 

Todd: these really gross, gross. Oh, this was so funny too, when, uh, it’s disgusting. And, uh, Justin Long in his interview was talking about doing this scene, and he said, you know, the, the actor who played, uh, who played the woman is actually a, a man. Yeah. And, uh, he’s, he’s pretty good actor. He’s well known.

He’s done a number of other movies, uh, has played, uh, in makeup, uh, in a lot of them. He’s quite good in this role, in this 

Craig: film. He is good in this because ultimately he’s sympathetic. She the character, she is sympathetic. Yeah. Matthew Patrick Davis is his name. Handsome man. I’m looking at his pictures.

Nice looking guy. 

Todd: Yeah, he, um, he dirties up. Well, I was, I suppose, and he was like, you know, filming the scene was of course very awkward because, uh, you’re riding a fine line here between. Making this kind of a little ridiculous, uh, or silly, or being a little campy or funny or, or dumb. And, uh, so he really struggled with this, trying to make it right.

And he said, of course, it’s, he’s trying to build up his emotional level. It’s hard to do. He said, horror movie sets are rarely actually scary. , you know, they’re just full of people and you’re surrounded in all that. So he is trying to build up this intensity and trying to do this scene, which is difficult.

And in between takes, Patrick is being super sweet to him. He is like, are you okay? Is everything all right? Do you need anything? And he says, which number one is weird coming from this guy in this disgusting mother evil makeup, but also is kind of taking him outta the moment, like , it’s hard for him to get so worked up again and start to be afraid when he’s being so sweet to him.

But, uh, yeah, he said this was definitely a challenging scene to take. And again, it could have been very different. Instead it’s gross and utterly terrifying. Uh, the d the filmmaking here is just fantastic. Yeah. 

Craig: And I don’t. Remember at what point, because I know that she, um, gets back into the house, into the basement of the house, but mm-hmm.

she’s locked in the basement again. So she goes to the window and starts crawling out the window. And the scary homeless guy who had been chasing her before, grabs her and pulls her out just a split second before the mother appears at the window and reaches out for her, but doesn’t get her. And then the mother just, uh, slinks back into the darkness and the homeless guy was says, I told you not to go in there,

And and he says, and she’s not even the scariest thing down there. And I was like, what? right. I believe is this when it cuts away? Cause eventually it cuts to another scene, like, like the same kind of jarring cut as before it jump cuts. To the same house, but clearly at a different time. Because, because it, the neighborhood looks nice.

It looks like a very nice, uh, small suburban neighborhood. 

Todd: Like in the eighties, Uhhuh when, you know, when the auto industry was booming and I actually lived in DC at this time. Detroit, you know, it was, I’m sorry. Yeah. I lived in Detroit at this time. It was very, uh, optimistic and everybody was making money working in the auto factories and things like that.

It was, uh, different 

Craig: than it is now. A man comes walking out of the house, we find out his name is Frank, but he’s played by Richard Break, uh, who is so recognizable. He just has a very recognizable face. He’s very tall and lean. Uh, kind of got a gruff face. I recognized him immediately from, uh, 31 Rob Zombies 31.

He played Doom Head, like the worst of the people. Crazy murderous game or whatever. Um, and he’s worked with Rob Zombie in other movies too. In fact, I think he is even in the monsters. Oh. But, but he’s creepy. Oh gosh. And, and his whole thing doesn’t take very long. He goes to a grocery store and he asks for help.

He needs plastic sheets because he’s going to be doing a home birth and, and it’s just gonna be him, no midwife or anything, which the grocery store person doesn’t find all that strange, I would find that strange. Right. But she gives him everything he’ll need, including like a, uh, instructional what to do with your baby vhs.

Yeah. Which I don’t even think that I noticed the first time around as I was watching it, I was thinking it was just a self-help book. But in hindsight, no. It’s a video. It’s the video that we’ve already seen. And then before he goes back home, he follows a woman that he sees in the parking lot. He follows her to her house, poses as a water and power employee to get into her house and unlocks her bathroom window.

So we know exactly who this guy is. Like he’s got a pair of coveralls in his trunk with a, a fake name on it. This just seems like something that he does. Mm-hmm. . And when he gets back to his house, his neighbor comes up to him and says, Hey, I just wanted to give you the heads up. Uh, there’s gonna be a for sale sign in our.

Uh, yard. Um, we’re getting outta here. We’re afraid if we wait any longer, we won’t be able to sell the house. And he said, the neighbor says, you think you’ll move? And the guy says, no, I, I’m, I’m never leaving . And then he walks into the house and it’s, you know, obviously in the eighties style, but it is the house.

Yep. And he walks all the way to the back and he opens the basement door and you hear screaming and crying. A woman screaming and crying from the basement. Yeah. So we know the history, at least some history of this house. But when it, when we come back, she, uh, has gotten out and she goes to the p she finds a gas station and she calls the police.

And they don’t take her seriously at all. They take her back to the house. But because she’s all dirty and she can’t provide any identification, they think she’s just some crackhead and they totally disregard her. Yeah. And leave her there alone. The homeless guy comes back and says, you gotta get outta here cuz she comes out at night.

But, and, but she says, but there’s somebody else down there. I have to help. I have to help him. She waits, I guess, till nighttime. Mm. And then the mother comes running out of the house and she plows the mother into the side of the house with her car. Yeah. And it seems like the mother dies. Yeah. So she, so she goes in looking for Justin Long, meanwhile, Justin Long is exploring around down there and comes across another room with a man, an old sick man in a bed.

Yeah. And it’s the guy that we had just seen, it’s frank, but obviously he’s aged 50 years or however long it’s been. And he’s old and decrepit and he doesn’t talk or anything. It’s everything down there is disgusting. And I didn’t notice the first time. I did notice the second time, there’s a whole bookshelf.

Loaded with VHS tapes. Mm-hmm. . And eventually before, uh, AJ notices the tapes, he says to the guy, um, don’t worry, I’m gonna get us out of here. The cops will be here any minute. And, uh, when he says that, Frank gestures towards something on the nightstand, but AJ can’t figure out what it is that he wants. So he just moves the nightstand over, uh, next to him.

And then AJ goes and starts looking around and he finds the shelf with all of the videotapes on it. And they all have like either women’s names or descriptions, like redhead from the gas station or puker or things like that. And he pops one. And we just see the light from the television illuminating his face as he’s horrified by what he sees.

And he turns around and Frank has pulled a gun out of the nightstand, and AJ’s like, no, no, no. Wait, wait. Um, but he doesn’t point it at him. He pointed at himself and shoots himself in the head. Mm-hmm. , obviously this guy knows that if the cops do show up there, he’s gone. It’s over for. Yeah, so , so AJ tries to get out, but he shoots Tess, which I don’t understand.

I, I guess he just sees her flashlight and, and is scared and so he shoots her. Yeah. I mean, 

Todd: he is coming down that hallway and she’s coming down to help him, but she’s not like really yelling out I’m, it’s confusing and I’m sure he’s just jumpy and he’s waiting for that. Lady to come jumping out at him because she should still be down there as far as he 

Craig: knows.

Yeah. Yeah. But she’s not dead. She looks dead for a second, but she’s not. And he helps her up and they go out. But as they get outside, the, the mother is gone. Um, she is no longer pinned to the house, so they don’t have a car. His keys are in the tunnels. And he says, I’m not going back down there. She says, I know where to go.

Cuz the homeless man had told her that he lives under the water tower. So they go to the water tower, they find the homeless man, and they say, who is she? Uh, AJ’s like, that’s my house. I, and he says, well, you may own the deed, but that’s been his house for the past 40 some years. And he said he used to take women in there and then he’d make babies with them and then he’d make babies with the babies.

Uh, and when you make copy, after copy, after copy, eventually that’s what you get. And she just lives down there and comes out at night. And he’s like, but don’t worry. I, I’ve been staying here 15 years and she never comes here. And as soon as he says that, she grabs him from behind, picks him him up, bursts through the wall.

Yeah. Bursts through the wall. Grabs him, picks him up, rips off his arm and beats him to death with it. . Oh my gosh, 

Todd: that was funny. That was, it was funny. Buddy 

Craig: moment. So AJ and Tes take off running, but they’re in kind of like a, I don’t know, they’re, they’re fenced in, so the only place for them to go is up.

So they start going up the water tower and when they get to the top, Tess is like your gun cuz he has one, he took Frank’s gun, he pulls it out and then fumbles it and drops it over the side. So they’re stuck up there and the mother is coming, she’s right on their heels. So, God, I mean like, I can’t say that I’m surprised.

It’s just, again, it’s so jarring to see from Justin Long. He’s like, we’re trapped, she’s gonna kill us both. And he says, So I can get away. You’re gonna have to distract her. So just as the mother gets to the top, he throws her off the water tower. Yeah. 

Todd: Test. You know, it’s funny you say you weren’t sur you were a little surprised, but you weren’t.

I I was the same way because there’s a scene we missed and I can’t remember what it was, but there’s a moment where Justin’s Long’s character is sitting and he is with some other people. And 

Craig: it was right before this with her. Yeah. And the homeless guy. And, and he’s 

Todd: like, I, I did a bad thing. I, I don’t think I, I might have done a bad thing.

I’m not a bad person. I can’t be a bad person. He’s really talking about his remorse back, you know, with over the rape incident 

Craig: and saying, he’s gonna fix it. I’m gonna fix it, I’m gonna make it. And, 

Todd: and this is almost like he’s redeeming himself by fixing their situation as well. So, you know, he’s got this on his mind.

Clearly it’s even in this intense moment, this is still weighing heavily on him and it seems like he’s trying to be a good person. And then he does this, which is just the most despicable thing, 

Craig: right? And it’s awful. But then also the perspective I think kind of shifts. I don’t know if it’s, we’re supposed to kind of be seeing what she’s seeing as she’s falling.

Yeah. But we’re, we’re looking up at the water tower and in kind of slow motion you see the mother dive. Off the side. Mm-hmm. . And it’s a beautiful shot. Uh oh. It’s amazing. It just looks fantastic. And then it cuts back to him and he looks over the side and somehow Tess has landed on top of the mother.

Mm-hmm. , and they both appear to be dead. And so he goes down. And looks, and it turns out the test isn’t dead. And, and he makes some excuse. And it almost sounds like he’s making excuses to himself. Yeah. Cause, cause at first he says, oh, I didn’t have any choice. Uh, but, but, but I didn’t even do anything that you, you slipped, like he’s, he’s re reframing the narrative.

Mm-hmm. not just for her, but I think for himself too. He doesn’t wanna believe or admit that he did what he did. Um, but he, he kind of helps her up. But then it turns out the mother is not dead either, which is totally unrealistic. But, um, she gets up, she grabs him, lifts him in the air, gouges his eyeballs with her long, gross, nasty fingernails, and then rip.

His head just apart. 

Todd: And that’s satisfying at this point. totally. We’re ready for him to die at that moment. And it happens at that moment. Absolutely. It’s very cathartic. It, it’s, I don’t understand how the mother ended up underneath this woman. 

Craig: I don’t know. It defies physics. I, I guess the suggestion is that she was jumping to try to help or protect Tess because Tess is her baby.

Maybe 

Todd: she grabbed her midair 

Craig: and flipped around or something. Who knows? Doesn’t make any sense. But I, that, I think that’s what we’re supposed to believe. Yeah. And then this part surprised me and surprised me even more on the second viewing. The mother comes over to Tess, who is still on the ground and she’s, the mother is trying to comfort her and like points to her wound and tries to cover it and is stroking her face and, and looking back towards the house, just going ba, ba and Tessa’s saying I can’t go back.

Really? The mother is just, Caressing her and trying to lift her up to try to take her back home. I actually felt very sympathetic towards this. monstrous woman in this moment. She’s a 

Todd: victim too. She is. You know, I mean the, the whole movies is about this, you know, it’s, it’s such a fake out in the beginning where we think the movie’s gonna be about this man who prays on this woman, and it turns out he’s the only good, decent guy.

Uhhuh, that Tess encounters in this whole scenario. Right. Everybody else is, even the, the male cops are absolutely no help to her. 

Craig: Right, right. So and so, yeah, so this woman, this poor woman, has led this terrible life, but not her fault. She, she’s a victim too, but ultimately, you know, Tess reaches for the gun and, and, and shoots her.

Uh, and it immediately, Cuts to black and that song from the sixties, I think, be My Baby, uh, plays. It’s really ironic and funny. Um, and there are a couple, it, it, it cuts back to Tess a couple of times as you see her picking herself up and the mother’s dead body is laying there. And then it goes back to the credits for a second and then it cuts back to her and just shows her walking away as uh, the dawn comes and you know that that’s it.

But ultimately I just thought it was a really fun ride. But it was, it was the shocking elements that made it so fun going back and watching it a second time. Uh, it felt a little bit more typical. I wasn’t as shocked by the appearance of the mother cuz I knew what to expect and, you know, I knew the backstory already.

It, it, it’s fun to let everything unfold the first time you see this movie. It’s a really fun experience and would be fun to share. With friends. That’s the only reason I think that I would watch it again was if I could watch it with somebody else who hadn’t seen it before. I think it experience it through their eyes.

Yeah. Uhhuh, I think it would be fun to see their, uh, reactions and stuff, but um, having seen it now twice, I’m good, but I do solidly recommend it. It’s a good. 

Todd: It is. I, it’s a fun ride. It’s tense. It goes in unexpected places, twists and turns everywhere. I have to admit, I was a little disappointed when the mom came out at the first bit, and this was my first time through.

I was like, uh oh. It’s like a mutant now you’ve shown me what it is that, you know, the mystery’s kind of gone and it’s gonna be one of those mutant things, but then the movie took enough left turns from there on out that, uh, yeah. I was like, didn’t have a problem with it anymore. Yeah. And it’s, it’s dark material.

Mm-hmm. like dark, scary. Within the realm of reality in a way, you know, we’re not talking about supernatural elements here. We’re just talking about this crazy kind of sad, inbred victim woman with this guy who does this terrible thing. And like I said, this is, this kind of thing happens. It’s in the news.

Yeah. So, uh, I had 

Craig: kind of forgotten about that, but you’re right. It, it probably was about 10 years ago that there were like two or three stories back to back. Oh man. About these men keeping, I think, you know, their daughters and then fathering children with their daughters and, you know, that’s such a real life nightmare.

And then of course, these women are found and let out into the world. They have children. Mm-hmm. , you know, by their father. And how do you move forward from that? I can’t even begin to imagine, 

Todd: isn’t that like more or less unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt? Uh, yeah. Backstory as well. Uh, you know, this. As dark as it was and as tense as it was.

Interjected. Little bits of comedy here and there. Yeah. Uhhuh. But it was never distracting from the plot. It was never, never devolved into camp. No, it was, it was also never obvious. Or like, okay, you know, now people are wise cracking and being silly in this, you know, bad situation. Just very, very skillful film making.

And I think that, uh, this director, Zach Kreger, is gonna get a lot of work from this movie. Yeah, 

Craig: I would think so. Cuz it’s really well done. Mm-hmm. , I mean, just technically it looks great. Oh yeah. It’s a really good looking movie. It’s well shot. 

Todd: It seems to be doing well too. I mean, uh, it’s, people are talking about it.

Yeah. People are talking about, they’re getting a lot of buzz. It’s getting good reviews on, um, you know, rotten tomatoes and stuff like that. I think financially it’s been successful. Uh, it was shot for four and a half million, uh, but because a lot of it’s on streaming, uh, there aren’t really a lot of figures right now as to what it’s making.

Right. But, uh, I can’t imagine that this movie is, isn’t making a lot of money right now among, among the horror. Well, thank you for recommending it Craig. Really, really enjoyed it. You guys out there, if you have any thoughts or if you’ve seen this movie recently, please check us out online. You can go to our Facebook page.

That’s one of the easiest ways to reach us. But also you can go to our website, 2guys.red40net.com, and leave us a message there. You can also, uh, join the conversation over at our Patreon page. If you donate about five bucks a month or 10 bucks a month, whatever you want, you get access to a bunch of little extras as well as a little more direct access to us.

We, uh, are quite active with chatting back and forth with our patrons there. We have a discord that you can access and, uh, some goodies as well. So please check that out at patreon.com/chainsawpodcast. Until next time, I’m Todd. And I’m Craig with Two Guys and a Chainsaw.