Ravenous (1999)

Episode 33, 2 Guys and a Chainsaw

Todd: Welcome to another edition of Two Guys in a Chainsaw. I’m Todd.

Craig: I’m Craig.

Todd: And today we are covering the 1999 film, Ravenous. This was my choice. I have really fond feelings for this film. I really like it, and I think it’s the kind of movie that’s kind of gone under the radar. Not a lot of people know about it, despite the fact that it has a cast that’s extremely recognizable.

And I think it’s a pretty well made movie. Yeah. Have you ever heard of it before? 

Craig: You know, I know I have heard of it. Um, You know, I, I look around at, uh, horror movie websites and, uh, Bloody Disgusting and Fangoria and whatnot. And I remember there being some talk about this. But I was surprised when you told me it came out in 1999, because I, I don’t remember following things as closely back then, so I don’t know if I just saw some feature on it, you know, as kind of a forgotten piece or what, but I, I had heard of it, but I knew next to nothing about it other than what you told me was that it was kind of a period piece, and that’s about it.

That’s about all I knew. Yeah, I, 

Todd: uh, Stumbled on it, I think it was actually a friend, a really good friend of mine who told me you have to see this movie and I’m pretty sure he saw this movie just because of the time frame it took. He’s a real, like, Civil War buff, old, old American history type thing. Uh, the movie takes place in 1847, shortly after the, uh, Mexican American War.

And I believe that he told me, uh, you just gotta see it. And I, I went into it, I, I rented it at Blockbuster, remember back when Blockbuster? I was on an internship and, uh, I was coming home from work and I had absolutely nothing to do. So I was watching a lot of movies and I picked this one up. I watched it.

I was so taken by it that the DVD had four commentaries on it. And I sat there that night and I rewatched the movie another three times, the director’s commentary, the writer’s commentary, and, uh, Guy Pierce, I believe, uh, and a couple of the other actors, uh, did a commentary. And then the last commentary was the person who played, uh, Calhoun, or otherwise, which actually didn’t even start until, you know, he comes in, which is quite a bit into the movie.

And it was actually pretty boring, his part, but the rest of it, I was just fascinated by it. It just seemed like this, how did I not know about this movie, and why is it so charming? Yeah, I don’t know. Yeah, it’s, 

Craig: it’s, I mean, it is, it’s a well made movie, and I’m surprised that it That I hadn’t heard more about it, but maybe it’s because it’s really kind of different.

I mean, it’s, uh, I don’t know, maybe you’ll disagree with me, but when it comes down to it, it’s basically a vampire movie, right? No, I totally agree. I mean, they, they play it off as, as cannibalism, which it is, but there’s also a supernatural element to it where they, Um, talk about, and we’ve talked about this uh, just recently with Pet Sematary, the Native American belief in the Wendigo, um, and they go a little bit, you know, I don’t really know a whole lot about that myth that what they play up here is that the Wendigo like, uh, I don’t know, It’s like a 

Todd: spirit or something that when it, or a creature, when it eats the flesh of a man, becomes insatiable and needs that flesh and gets its energy and its power absorbed from that thing.

So I guess in a sense, uh, I get, is it the idea of the Wendigo as a creature, then we can all be Wendigos if we eat the flesh of another, much like the vampire? Yeah, right, right. I 

Craig: mean, that’s what they were saying here. And yeah, that’s it. I mean, if a person eats another person, they absorb their strength, they absorb their spirit, and it makes them stronger.

Gives them kind of supernatural strength and healing abilities. And so it’s vampires, . Yeah. Really, basically it is, it come down to, 

Todd: and some element of this has always been kind of, um, aspect of different cultures, uh, warlike cultures where you’ll find that people think that e the eating, the heart of their enemy will give them some strength or some power, some virility.

There was some practice of that in, even in Western cultures at some point, more barbaric cultures, but. So it’s not a totally unusual thing. What makes this kind of weird is the idea that, like a vampire, that changes you. Right. And you become a supernatural being that can’t be harmed, 

Craig: really. Well, and that’s kind of what I was saying.

I mean, it is, in essence, a vampire movie. But at the same time, it’s kind of not. So, like, it doesn’t really fall into a really specific genre of horror. And so maybe that’s why it didn’t make it. Have as much draw or appeal. I don’t know. I, when you mentioned this, you know, I had heard of it, but I’ll be honest.

I wasn’t super excited about it. Like you threw out a couple of names and of the ones you threw out, this was kind of the one that was like, eh, I don’t know. I wasn’t 

Todd: surprised, but how did you feel by the end of it? I liked 

Craig: it. I liked it. And I think that part of, I just am not really big into period movies.

I think I, I tend to prefer more contemporary. But I liked this one. It was intriguing. Now, I will say that there were elements of it that I found pretty predictable, um, but it had some good twists, too, that I didn’t see coming. And so that, I was pleased with that. I enjoyed 

Todd: it. That’s interesting you call it predictable.

Did you read up about it at all? No, I didn’t read anything. Didn’t even read a synopsis? Nope. Not a one 

Craig: line situation? Well, I maybe read Something that says, like, they’re at an outpost and a mysterious stranger comes and causes havoc, something like that. Oh, okay. Alright, yes. Um, but that’s about 

Todd: all I knew.

Well, that’s kind of what happens. Right. The movie starts out, uh, Guy Pearce’s character is a, uh, captain, Captain John Boyd. Uh, in the American, uh, Army, and the scene starts out with a, sort of some flashbacks and a banquet scene where he’s being awarded a medal for bravery. And he’s given this very large, very juicy, very delicious looking steak in front of him.

But it’s flashing back to, obviously he’s just come out for the battlefield and just having these flashbacks to the gore and the grossness of the battlefield and he’s looking at the steak. And at that moment we’re thinking, Oh yeah, this guy’s damaged. She’s got some PTSD and he just can’t eat the steak because it reminds him of the gore of the battlefield.

Craig: Right. And there’s just the tiniest little underlying comedy throughout the whole movie too. I mean, it’s certainly not the focus, but that scene that you’re talking about is All these, you know, male military officials sitting around this huge table, all of them eating these huge steaks, like, like cartoon size, like rare to medium rare.

And like, you can hear them sawing into them and chomping on it. It’s really unappetizing. It kind of is actually, yeah. And uh, you see that the main character, Boyd. It’s like he’s disgusted by the meat. Like he can’t bring himself to eat it. And it makes sense because he’s flashing back to all that gore that he saw.

You know, people dying all around him. So The colonel 

Todd: is looking at him and pulls him aside and says, You’re no hero. Right. I’m just going to send you away to this outpost. And the colonel, by the way, played by John Spencer, played the colonel. You might recognize him from West Wing. Right. In fact, this was his last film role.

Yeah, I read that. So, yeah, and he basically tells him, You’re no hero. And this is, of course, after awarding him the medal. And sends him off to this outpost. Basically out in the middle of nowhere. In the middle of the American, um, Mountains, essentially. Right in California. The spot between the East and the West.

And it’s interesting because, I think the film does a really good job at this point of setting up this mystery. And I feel like it carries a sense of mystery all throughout, which I felt made it a little unpredictable in many ways. In that, when you look back on this scene, having seen the film, it gains more significance, right?

Oh, he just got awarded a medal. Oh, now he says he’s no hero, and he’s essentially punishing him by sending him to this outpost with all these other people who clearly also are being sent away for one reason or another. These are like the scraps of the army that nobody knows what to do with. 

Craig: Kind of inept, you know, goofy kind of characters.

Todd: So the question becomes, well, why? Why are they doing this to him? What’s his story and why is he just so dazed all the time and, and weirded out? 

Craig: Well, we get that back story pretty early on, don’t we? I mean, we find out, um, that what had happened was, uh, he had, I guess, been near uh, enemy lines. He, he and his, uh, And when, I guess it’s the Mexican army, you said the Mexican American war, then when the Mexican army, you know, when they were in battle, the Americans were losing, and rather than try to be a hero and go down in a blaze of glory, Boyd instead played dead.

So when the Mexican army picked up, they lost. He ended up on the bottom of this big pile of bodies and he said something about one of his troops or his commanding officer or something was right on top of him with his head half blown off and his blood was running down over his face and down his throat.

And the guy asked him, whoever the colonel or whatever asked him, well, So then what happened? And he said, well, something changed. And you see him drag himself out from underneath all these bodies, and he goes and, uh, breaks the neck of one of the Mexican soldiers, grabs his gun, and I guess kind of captures the, uh, 

Todd: Yeah, it allows so that the others can come in and take it over.

Right. The, uh, colonel is, at one point, saying, I should kill you, but that doesn’t look good, since you actually Are the one who Are the one who saved it, so your cowardice turned out to be fine. Now, when you, when you were watching this, did you, in his backstory, put together this notion that it was maybe the blood 

Craig: of his I knew that it had to be significant, and I knew that that had to be why He wasn’t eating the meat.

Oh, wow. Because, I mean, because it’s an odd thing to say. His blood was running down my throat. You know, I mean, it would be one thing to say I was covered in blood or whatever, but to be so specific as to say his blood was running down my throat and then something changed. Okay. Well, there’s 

Todd: something going on.

Fair enough. Okay. That makes sense. I, for one, uh, again, I had to look back on all this after the film. To realize the significance of all of it. I felt like he was really just describing the horrors of war and the horrors of what he went through. Uh, it wasn’t until we, turns out that this film was about cannibals that you can look back on the scenes and go, Oh yeah, that’s why.

Um, at least for me, but you’re smarter than I am. 

Craig: Like, apparently. 

Todd: Way more on the lookout. Way more on the lookout for significance. Well, I mean, 

Craig: I didn’t, I didn’t know really what was going on yet. I just knew that there had to be something going on. And then, so he gets sent out to this outpost, and it’s funny, because they say they’re sending him to California.

I think of California as being sunny and warm. Yeah. But they’re in the mountains, like the Sierra Nevada mountains or whatever, so when they get out, When he gets there, it’s cold and snowy and desolate, and it’s really just this tiny little outpost with these shoddy, you know, kind of cabins and teepees and things.

It’s like 

Todd: a fort that anybody could take . Yeah. Right, right. It’s got walls up around it in a big gate, but it doesn’t look like it would take much to knock this down when he, it’s really just for supplies and things essentially. 

Craig: Right, right. And that when he gets. there. The guy who’s in charge, Captain Hart, who’s played by Jeffrey Jones, who again is a really recognizable face.

You’ll recognize him from Beetlejuice and he was in the Crucible. I mean, he’s, he worked, he used to work a lot. He sure did. Um, he doesn’t work so much anymore. He 

Todd: kind of imploded. There was a bit of a scandal, wasn’t 

Craig: there? Yeah. I think child pornography or something. That was it. Yeah. Um, which, you know, that’s gross and unexcusable, Unfortunate because he’s a good actor.

Yeah, 

Todd: and you know, he brings a certain quality. It’s hard to see him in any role That’s not at some level of comedy, right? I think once you see him in a movie you almost expect that it’s going to be a goofy Yeah, 

Craig: he that’s part of the reason that I like him is that he kind of has a really good balance of where he can Be kind of serious and ominous, but at the same time he can also be kind of goofy Um, he was the principal in Ferris Bueller’s Day Off, right?

Yeah, anyway He, uh, just explains what’s going on. He’s like, you know, this was originally built as a mission by Native Americans, I think, and then we inherited it from them. And he basically says. We don’t really have anything to do. He says something like, tedium is kind of the order of the day, or whatever.

Todd: Yeah, and his thing is uh, reading, well, he’s trying to crack walnuts. He’s having a real hard time and he gets up and it’s a humorous scene where he’s telling what he does, and what he does is he reads philosophy and big, heavy heady books and he uses one of these giant books to crack one of his walnuts.

Right. And we immediately are introduced to all the characters because he’s explaining everybody to uh, uh, to Guy Pearce’s character. 

Craig: And I was nervous because there were a lot of them. And I was thinking, how am I going to keep track of all these characters names? 

Todd: It’s easy because they’re like cartoon characters, right?

Every one of them has a thing. Right. 

Craig: Yeah. So there’s, there’s Knox, who I guess is a captain, but the way that we’re introduced to him is that he’s just kind of drunk all the time, right? 

Todd: Also supposed to be the doctor. So it’s like, don’t 

Craig: get sick. Um, there’s Reich who is described as the soldier and he’s kind of the rough.

He’s a tough, brutal 

Todd: one. He’s almost, he’s almost like, uh, you know those movies from the 80s where the Russians were invading. Yeah. Like, the white short hair. They all Lundgren and really built and buff and just, all 

Craig: the time. And again, such a recognizable face. I’m not sure the actor’s name. I remember him.

He did a short scene. But you’ve seen him all over the place. He’s got these icy blue eyes. Yeah, with stunning eyes. Yeah, tough guy. Then there’s, um, George and Martha, which I thought was pretty funny. Um, they’re the Native Americans who, I guess, just help out around the camp or whatever. Cleaves, I think played by David Arquette.

Yeah, and he’s like the stoner one 

Todd: You wouldn’t think you could stick a stoner in an 1847 film, but peyote Right native Americans around right a local weed 

Craig: And he’s he’s he’s the cook too, and then there’s Toffler? Was that the, and he’s the quiet one and the minister and that’s, that’s their little group.

And that’s Jeremy Davies? Jeremy Davies, right. Yeah, again, he’s one of those people that I’ve seen in so many movies, but I can’t necessarily place exactly where. A good strong 

Todd: cast. It is, and I, did you feel the acting was, uh, was up to par? I did. I did too. Aside from the fact that they were clearly playing caricatured characters, which I think was just part of the comedy of the film.

Yeah. The acting was quite good. 

Craig: Well, right. And like David Arquette always kind of plays the same, like you cast David Arquette as David Arquette in your movies. 

Todd: But Jeremy Davies too, uh, you know, in some way, the sweet, soft 

Craig: little 

Todd: guy has all these weird ticks. You know, he has a very understated Jeff Goldblum at his, like his own take on acting like Jeff Goldblum does.

Craig: Right, right. And, and that’s it. I mean, they just entered like, just. In a matter of a minute and a half, you’re introduced to this whole cast of characters. And then it really, it jumps right into the story. I mean, this is, it’s not a slow paced movie at all. I mean, it keeps going, uh, the whole time. And so then, the big conflict, I guess, 

Todd: arrives.

Yeah, one of the guy, a guy just shows up at the camp and he’s outside and he’s cold and he’s, they see him through the window and he falls down. They bring him in to warm him up and wake him up, and, uh, he says that his name is Calhoun, and he has this Scottish accent. And he tells this story of being with another group, uh, with a whole group of people traveling through the wilderness, and, uh, they got beset by storms in winter, and so they all retreated into this cave to wait out the storm.

Only the storm never left. We ate 

Craig: the oxen, 

Todd: all the horses,

Craig: even my own dog. And that lasted us about a month. After that, we turned to our belts. Shoes. Any roots we could dig up, but you know, there’s no real 

Todd: nourishment in those. And eventually, they start eating each other. Uh, and the guy who, supposedly, was the most brutal of this group was this Colonel Ives who, uh, was leading the expedition.

Craig: See, and again, I knew this is where I thought that it was a little bit predictable because this guy, Calhoun, is telling this story and his version of the story is that he went out looking for supplies and when he came back, one of them had died of just exposure and and famine or whatever. And, um, so, when he came back They were eating this guy and he’s like, he acts like he was disgusted, he says, you know, if they had tried to do that and I had been there, would I have tried to stop them?

I don’t know, but he said, when I smelled the cooking meat, I thanked God and he says, I ate it, you know, and he said that he tried to eat sparingly, but others didn’t, and eventually This Colonel Ives guy started killing people to eat, you know, not just people dying of natural exposure, but actually killing them to eat.

And the reason that I found it predictable was because he concludes his story by saying it eventually got down to two of, the three of them, himself, the colonel, and a woman. Um, and he says that he was cowardly, the, the brave thing may have been to try to So, uh, this is a story about a guy named Colonel Ives, and he’s in the military, and uh, Colonel Hart says, well, I don’t recall ever having met any Colonel Ives, and he says, well, Good for you, because he’s a real jerk, and he’s a terrible, terrible human being.

We see all of the other characters in the flashback except Colonel Ives. Right. And so I knew that there was something shady going on. Okay, fair enough. And so, right, And again, things move very quickly. They say, you know, he tells the story. Colonel Hart said, well, is there a chance that the woman is still there?

And he says, yeah, as far as I know, Ives and the woman are still there. And Hart says, well, we have to go try to rescue them. That’s our job. And they go. And the whole time I was thinking, and Calhoun says he wants to go with them. And I, I, I’m thinking he’s lying. There’s a setup of some kind. I didn’t know if it was, I don’t know if I necessarily saw the setup coming, but I knew he was lying and I knew that he was the one who had really eaten everybody.

Todd: Okay, fair enough. Right. That actually came as a bit of a surprise to me. I, I really didn’t know what to expect when I first saw this film. And especially because they do give you some reasons to, to believe that he is, Well, they are certainly casting suspicion on him, as you say. But they also give you a couple moments where he’s putting himself in a vulnerable spot.

For example, as they go on their expedition, uh, they stop and they have a little chat. And it’s interesting, and again, this is another scene where, in retrospect, it makes a lot more sense than it did at the time. Where, um, Boyd asks Calhoun a little more detail, like, After you ate the meat, you said that you more revived.

Yeah. And he’s like, uh, what, what do you mean by that? You can tell he’s putting it together with his previous experience of Right, 

Craig: with his previous experience and because before they had left, George, the Native American, had shown Park and Boyd this, um, it looked like a piece of tapestry or something with some Native American artwork on it and it was a sketch, uh, of, uh, George.

Some kind of monstrous being, you know, not totally inhuman looking, but with like big bloody teeth and eating another person. And, and, uh, George explains the legend of the Wendigo, and explains that when a person and Wendigo or whatever eats another person, they get more strength. And so, so then Boyd asks him, did you say you felt stronger?

And Calhoun says, yeah, I do seem to kind of remember feeling a little bit more virile. 

And 

Todd: when you’re first watching it, you’re thinking, oh, well, he’s trying to make this connection to the Wendigo myth. But then you can also know later on that. Clearly, he was also thinking about his own personal experience.

Craig: Right, because when he said that the blood was running down his throat, he said something changed, and then he was able to pull himself out. So 

And 

Todd: this guy, otherwise, is a real wiener. I mean, he, he can’t stand the sight of blood. Right. Uh, he doesn’t know what to do in stressful situations. He is cowardly.

He’s extremely cowardly. So, uh For him to change and suddenly not be cowardly would be something that even he would notice. Right. Yeah. So, uh, they continue on and one of the crew, uh, Toffler The pastor guy finds a bone and in the process ends up sort of falling down the mountain and getting injured. And so then they set up camp that night and go to sleep.

He wakes up screaming in the middle of the night, yelling that Calhoun was licking him, was licking his wound, which is, and Calhoun is right. He’s got blood on his right. It’s clear that it’s been 

Craig: happening. Well, and I really liked that scene, too, because you see it, but it’s all in really, like, darkness. So you, you see kind of silhouetted movement, and you hear, like, kind of a lapping sound, and then the guy starts screaming, and they turn all the lights on, and you see Calhoun with just a little tiny bit of blood on his lips.

Todd: And he’s really not denying it, uh, he’s just, he’s freaking out. He’s like, I can’t help, it’s essentially what you’re thinking, at least what I was thinking. was, well he can’t help it. He’s got this Wendigo thing. He doesn’t mean them any harm, but almost like, you know, again, like this vampire who doesn’t want to drink blood, but needs to is doing it.

And he begs them to tie him up. He’s like, please, I can’t be trusted, tie me up. And to me, that was something that brings you back to that side of, okay, well maybe he’s Not planning anything sinister after all, because after all he’s asking to be tied 

Craig: up. At the 

Todd: same time, why would he be so brazen, you know, as to be licking 

Craig: this guy?

Right, right. Um, and I think that that goes, you know, that’s, that’s kind of classic vampire stuff. You know, we saw that in, in let me in and, and we’ve, you know, in other movies where it’s like they have to, to survive, they have, you know, it’s, it’s instinct or impulse. But again, I don’t know. I think maybe it was because of.

The actor who plays Calhoun, he’s been in so many things and he always is shifty and like you, he’s just got this appearance about him. Like he can’t be trusted. 

Todd: He has a look to him. Right. You’re right. 

Craig: He really does. And so I was just suspicious of, and he acts that way too, you know, that’s, that’s kind of his affect.

And so I, I just didn’t trust him at all. So even when he said, tie me up, you know, So, the tough guy, Reich, his immediate instinct was to kill him and the, the quiet little minister guy is like, yeah, do it. Like, this guy’s a freak. Um, but they, but they get him outside and he says, I was having a nightmare and when he started screaming, I woke up and I was doing it.

I didn’t even know I was doing it. So please just, I can’t be trusted. Time me up again. Yes. He’s shady. Right. It’s just really shady. Too 

Todd: weird. No, that makes sense. I mean, you know, something’s going on. What 

Craig: I was thinking was. He was Colonel Ives, there may probably have been a guy named Calhoun, but he ate him.

Todd: I think you’re probably right about that. Yeah, no, I think you’re right. Well, and that’s what we come to find out because they happen on the cave. Calhoun. Kind of runs off by the side of the cave. They’re, they’ve kind of got a leash on them, but they kind of let the leash go. Yeah. And that 

Craig: part was weird because he was acting really strangely like whimpering.

And well, 

Todd: I took it to be fear. Like he was really didn’t want to be there after all. Right. He was trying to get away and they’re jerking him around and it’s the soldier guy, right. Reich who’s doing it. But finally, right. Kind of gets occupied. Both he and, uh, Steve. All 

Craig: these names. Yeah, I know, so many names.

It’s okay because everybody’s gonna die pretty soon. True, yeah, 

Todd: we’ll get right down to a few. 

Craig: Right. But Colonel Hart sends Reich and Boyd in. He has to send, he has to send Boyd in because Boyd is an officer and he needs an officer with the, I guess, for the exploration or whatever. It’s a little weak but.

So those two go in exploring the cave leaving, George and Colonel Hart and Toller, or Toffler, excuse me, outside with Calhoun. And to be 

Todd: fair, Toffler’s job is more or less to watch Calhoun. Pretty much. And he’s by the side, he’s really not, clearly not going to go anywhere. Who’s got the gun? It’s Toffler, so whatever.

So they go in and they are exploring what must have been the world’s largest cave. Oh yeah, I was really, I was, 

Craig: I know, I was, I was sitting here thinking, Wow, that’s a really nice 

Todd: cave you guys found there. And, uh, and they go in and they find a hole with a rope in it and they go down in the hole, or one of them goes down, right, does while Boyd stands up there.

In the meantime, outside, Calhoun is getting increasingly more bizarre in his activities. And the music is also coming in at this point and getting really, 

Craig: ch, ch, ch. Mm. Intense, you know, something’s coming and the music, the music in this film is great. Yeah, it’s really good. 

Todd: It’s so unusual to, it’s a mix of styles that really works.

It starts out as this old American sorts of Western. Yeah, things you would imagine are being played on a instruments that you’ve cobbled together, By the end of the movie, it’s almost an ethereal, supernatural, more typical type supernatural sound that’s coming from organs. 

Craig: Right, and sometimes there’s like Native American chant in the background.

I mean, you’re right, it’s a really interesting mix and it works really well. And I 

Todd: think the music does a lot to really ratchet up the tension in this scene. Yes, definitely in this scene. Besides the intercutting and the craziness of Calhoun. He starts scuffling, like, like approaching. Freaking out, uh, Toffler a little bit, but he kind of backs up.

He’s got his hands moving and he’s making these sounds with his mouth. And then he starts scratching at the ground. Like he’s digging in there looking for something. In the meantime, inside the cave, Rike comes across all the bodies. Uh, the butchered, hanging up bodies, and skeletons by now, puts two and two together by counting them, saying, Wait a minute.

Oh god.

Craig: How many did he say was in the 

Todd: party? Six, right? Why? 

Craig: Who’s this?

Liars. Oh Jesus.

It’s a trap! Um, and he climbs down. back up on the rope and they start running out shouting, it’s him, it’s him, Calhoun killed them all. But because it’s the world’s 

Todd: largest cave, it takes them quite a bit of time 

Craig: to get out there. And they don’t, the people outside don’t hear, I guess. 

Todd: It does stretch credibility considerably.

Anyway, what’s happening outside is extremely compelling. Essentially, Calhoun Uh, kills, or stabs, uh, first of all, Colonel 

Craig: Hart. Yeah, what he had been digging, he had had a knife buried. That’s 

Todd: right, he had pulled out the knife, stabs Hart, and then George 

Craig: tries to throw a hatchet at him, and this is right after he had stabbed, uh, Colonel Hart.

And Jeffrey Jones, at this point in his career, was not the skinny man that you remember from, uh, Ferris Bueller’s Day Off. He’s a big guy. And so, I don’t even know if I really noticed it at first, but I thought about it later. Calhoun to deflect the hatchet picks up Colonel Hart and moves him in front of him.

Todd: It would have taken a 

Craig: great deal of strength. Right. Yeah. Especially to pick that guy up, you know, dead weight with just his bare hands. And so then somehow he kills George. I think he shoots him. Yeah. Shoots George. George is dead. George falls down. And then he goes to shoot Toffler. But the gun is empty.

And so he’s, he’s, he’s, well that’s annoying. 

Todd: That’s the point at which it really turns, like, super funny. And, uh, he just approaches him with the knife and looks at him. And the guy’s just standing there and he’s looking at him. And the guy’s just standing there and he goes, Run. Yeah. Yeah. Like, dude, run.

Well, and 

Craig: I, I, I think what we’re supposed to believe, you know, Tothler’s not really a soldier anyway. I mean, he’s more of a timid kind of minister kind of guy, but he’s armed, you know, he’s carrying a rifle. He has a rifle. And he does it, in fact, when he goes to run, he throws it down on the ground. That’s right.

Todd: And takes off running. There’s no sense of self preservation. And at this point, the music turns to this, like, almost banjo y, run through the woods kind of music. It changes the tone entirely to this, and it lightens it considerably. By this time, the other two have come out, and they’ve seen him running after them, so they’re chasing him too.

So we get this running through the woods scene where Rike and Lloyd are chasing Calhoun, who is chasing Toffler. At this point, you start to get the sense that there’s something supernatural about They’re seeing him, but he’s not there. He’s really hard to find. Right. And then, it seems like he can cover great distances without them noticing, 

Craig: and with them noticing him.

And he can kind of appear and disappear without, I mean, literally appear and disappear. Like, he’s there one second, and then he’s gone the next. Exactly. And that’s when I started thinking, Vampire. I mean, this, this, this seems pretty classical vampire. They stumble upon Toffler. He’s dead. It looks like Calhoun maybe had a little snack.

Um, his, his abdomen’s all kind of ripped up and they keep chasing after him. And again, he’s doing that kind of appear, disappear, cat and mouse kind of thing. They end up confronting him on this cliff, this great big, huge cliff. It’s a great setting. Yeah. Oh yeah. It was beautiful. And I don’t remember exactly, I don’t remember how it happened, but Calhoun, how does Cal, he kills, kills Right.

Or he stabs him. Yeah. 

Todd: He runs up and stabs. I think he just comes out of nowhere, essentially, uh, and stabs Reich and he falls right over the edge. Right. Of this huge cliff. And Reich is the guy who you’re thinking, if anybody could take this guy on, he’s going to be the one in the company who can do it.

Right. So he’s dispatched pretty quickly, and once he falls over the cliff, you’re thinking, well, there’s no way he’s alive. Right. And that leaves the two of them on the cliff, and immediately, Boyd shoots him in the shoulder. And, you know, it’s a rifle blast right from close range. 

Craig: Like 10 feet away, 

Todd: maybe.

He falls backwards and just to the ground. And then Boyd sort of looks over the edge to try to see if Reich is there, doesn’t really know what to do. Starts to approach Calhoun. And Calhoun just sits up immediately and starts laughing. Mm-Hmm. . And that point in the movie Give Gives me a chills a little bit.

Yeah. Now you know, you’re dealing with the absolute supernatural. Right? It’s, and now they’re right there at the edge of the cliff. He backs ’em up and there’s nothing Boyd can do except leap off the 

Craig: cliff. Well, and again, I mean, he’s, I think it’s. reiterating the fact that he really is a coward. Like he just wants to get away and he, he jumps out.

I mean, it’s a huge cliff that we’re talking about folks. Like they’re looking down on these huge pine trees. And I figured that this was, was what’s going to happen. Is it, is it realistic? I don’t know. Uh, according to the laws of physics, I think it’s probably possible, but I knew this was what was going to happen.

He jumped off the cliff and like right into one of these big tall pine trees. So the tree. slows his descent all the way down and then he hits the ground and he starts rolling and again It’s kind of funny because he rolls directly over the body of reich and then reich starts rolling with them Like they’re rolling in this big pinwheel 

Todd: It’s it’s a comical it becomes comical just in how badly it’s it’s like a bruce campbell evil dead situation How badly this guy’s getting beat up that he’s still able to survive 

Craig: it.

Right. But it, I thought that it balanced it really well. It didn’t push it to the level where it seemed hokey. No, not at all. It was just little kind of clever winks and nods. It wasn’t too much. And I think that it really easily could have gone too far into that territory. I think they balanced it well.

Yes, 

Todd: exactly. This is no Zombieland or anything like that. It’s a black comedy, which we call black comedy. So, yeah, he falls down and into what must be a big hole in the ground or, you know, with the brush covering it because he’s fairly well hidden. And, at this point, Calhoun comes back down and he’s looking for them.

Now, he’s down in here with the body of Rike and trying not to make a noise. In the meantime, he has this broken leg. You can see the bone jutting out from it. It’s, I mean, that hurts almost more than anything else. I don’t know, you can see people getting their heads cut off and stuff, but once you see a broken hand You see the willies.

And, at this point, you feel like Calhoun is just playing with him, because he can smell. Uh huh. He’s smelling. He can, he’s standing right over at him and he’s smelling, and he just chooses to walk along. Right. And walk away. I’m pretty sure that he knew he was there. That was my take on it anyway. Yeah. But he wasn’t ready to dispatch him just yet.

He had other bodies to deal with. 

Craig: Yeah, I don’t know. I, I don’t know if I thought that he knew that he was there or not. Cause later on, he says, I found your buddy Reich, but I mean that’s neither, that’s neither here nor there. It’s possible, who knows. Yeah, who knows. But anyway, then there’s just kind of like this little montage where they have to let us know that time is passing, and we see the people back at camp, David Arquette and the native woman had gone out before Calhoun had even arrived, but they’re back now.

We see Calhoun enjoying his meals, like really relishing and just seeing what he’s doing. Sitting by the river and eating out bones. Right, right. Um, skipping stones along the water, you know, just very casual. And it’s clear that days are passing and, um, Boyd is still down there in the hole, uh, with Rike’s body.

And at some point he Sticks it like he straightens his bone. He sticks his bone back in, which is hilarious. People do this in movies all the time. I don’t believe it for a second. There is no way that you could do that to yourself. Now, somebody else doing it to you while somebody else held you down.

That’s one thing, but doing it yourself, I can’t believe that. Um, it was pretty obvious that he was in trouble down there and he’s, he kind of talks to the, to Reich’s body and whatnot. And I saw it coming, you know, eventually he was going to have to eat him and eventually. And that 

Todd: clearly gives him the strength that he needs to come 

Craig: out.

To walk back a three days walk on a broken leg. Yup. 

Todd: Exactly. And that’s interesting because he doesn’t want to do this. But he is forced to do this. So it, at some level, these survival cannibal movies always talk about this shady morality. What would you do to survive if you think it’s wrong to eat another person?

Well, get in that position where you have no other choice. And this poor guy is, uh, he knows that by eating a little bit of this guy, he is going to have the strength to get back. So he has even more of a dilemma, um, or even less of a choice maybe. I mean, if you know that it’s going to save you, it maybe becomes a 

Craig: little easier to do that.

Well, and he says, you know, he kind of, he, he talks to the body and he says, what should we do? I need you to tell me what to do. And then, you know, seconds later, more time has passed, but he goes over, crawls over to the body and he kind of looks him in the face and says, you’re dead. You’re dead. You’re safe.

Like, like he’s justifying it to himself. Like this isn’t going to hurt you. It’s just going to save me. And I can imagine that that probably. If you were in a life or death situation where you were either going to starve to death unless you ate something, you, you probably would start to rationalize a little bit.

I, I would imagine. Well, and now, you 

Todd: know, if, if, uh, if eating somebody meant that you could be like, superhuman, right? , we, we’d see a lot more cannibals in this world. Uh. Anyway, they, uh, they, he escapes, he makes it back to the camp. Uh, and the next scenes we see are him trying to explain this to the, again, that colonel, um, the one from the beginning, the, from the one from the beginning, who’s ba who’s at the camp.

It’s like, I, I don’t believe a word of it. We had people go down there. There’s nothing in the cave, there’s nothing anywhere around. All I know is that you have, uh, three men in your company missing, and, uh, I need a better explanation than this. Of course, he is unwilling or unable to provide it right away.

Craig: You know, he’s, he’s telling the story and he’s telling the truth of what we know actually happened, but the guy doesn’t believe him and he says, well, fine, whatever, but we have to set up new leadership here at least temporarily until we can get a new, uh, captain in. So here’s your new leader. It’s Colonel Ives.

And this was one of the parts that I didn’t see coming. I mean, I think you can put two and two together later, but in walks Calhoun in full military regalia. It’s pretty shocking, isn’t it? Yeah, it’s shocking. It is shocking. And I’m really not sure how I can’t kind of put the pieces together here. How did this head colonel or whoever come across Ives.

You know, if he’s been living out there in a cave for the last three months or whatever, as he said, how does he now suddenly appear and is being put in charge of this outpost? Yeah. Maybe it’s just because it’s such, they don’t care about this outpost at all that just as somebody raises their hand, I’ll do it.

You know, like it could be, 

Todd: you know, who knows what the army’s like. It’s a big place. But 

Craig: anyway, so obviously Boyd recognizes him, knows who he is. And he tells them that’s him. That’s Calhoun, but they don’t believe him. And he says, well, ask Knox. Knox was here. You know, he saw him. 

Todd: Fortunately, Knox was drunk, wasted, wasted at the time and absolutely was no help at all.

So you’ve got Knox who, who was too wasted to be able to recognize him. And then you have, uh, Martha and Cleaves who were 

Craig: gone. Right. So they didn’t see him at all. They don’t even know if the story is true. They don’t even know if there really was a guy. I mean, I guess that Knox can confirm that there was some guy, but that’s all he knows.

Yeah, he’s like, I think he had 

Todd: a beard, but 

Craig: that’s all I can remember. Right. And so they say, well, you said you shot him in the shoulder, and if you shot him in the shoulder, there would be a mark. So they make Ives take off, you know, expose his shoulders, and there’s nothing there. Um, but we know by this point that, Eating people helps them to heal more quickly.

So it makes sense from our perspective. 

Todd: Yeah, it’s really interesting. I also did not see that part coming at all. You couldn’t have imagined he would have been so bold and brazen as to come back as a soldier. And now he is just completely toying with his life. Well, 

Craig: and at that point, you know, like I said, this is the first time I’ve seen it.

I wasn’t exactly sure what was going on. I was thinking, is it the same guy? You know, like, or maybe is Boyd crazy? Maybe did Boyd go out there and kill 

Todd: all these people? Yeah, is this gonna be one of those? Kind of movies, 

Craig: right? Yeah. You do wonder. I, I wasn’t sure. But again, the movie moves so quickly as soon basically as Ives has convinced everybody else that he is who he says he is.

And he is not this Calhoun character, the first, and, you know, Boyd is really on edge. And of course everybody’s paranoid about him because he went out in the woods with all these people and none of the rest of ’em came back. So they think he may have had something to do with it. Um, but the, the very first time that Boyd and Iza.

Alone together, Ives just spills it. You know like, Yep, that was me! Yeah. I eat people. 

Todd: Yeah he has a long speech where he tells them that morale. You know, basically Boyd saying it’s wrong and Ives saying but didn’t you enjoy it? Can’t you tell, you know what the strength that you get And, and Ives tells him morality is the last bastion of the weak.

Um, and that hits Boyd where it hurts. ’cause he knows he’s the weakest of all of them. Right? Um, it becomes this bit of a morality play where, um, where Ives is making a case for this and saying, what choice do you have essentially? And, uh, don’t you want this? And Boyd is clearly. Not only because he’s eaten the meat, so he has the craving for it, but he’s fighting it like so badly.

He doesn’t want to be that guy. He’s 

Craig: fighting it. But like with vampires, the longer he’s gone without the weaker he’s becoming. And you see that in his makeup and he, you know, he looks really haggard. And at one point he swipes his knife at Ives and cuts him and Ives kind of holds it out. And it’s like, You smell it?

The scent always jogs the memory, 

Todd: don’t you think?

Craig: Remember the energy? The potency of someone else coursing through your veins. Someone brave. 

Todd: Not the 

Craig: disappointment as it dissipates. Strength slipping from your grasp. Growing, killing need to replenish.

I don’t have to remind you of that. You’re feeling it right now. And this was another reason why I thought, Oh my gosh, this is such a vampire movie, because there is so much homoerotic tension between Ives and Harker and Boyd. There really is. Oh my god, so much. It’s, it’s It’s not inconspicuous at all. And that, again, is, you know, you’ll find that.

You find that. You know, I’m thinking, and what’s his name, Boyd, almost even has kind of a Brad Pitt look about him. It was almost reminiscent of like Interview with the Vampire or something where you still have, you have those similar themes. 

Todd: Well, they’re both attractive people. Yeah. You know, I think Boydy and Ives both are, uh, are nice looking guys.

So yeah, you’re right, and he’s the head vampire toying with Boyd and trying to bring him in the fold, but again, like these vampire films, it is a seduction. It’s not a take you by force kind of thing. Yeah, 

Craig: and again, you’re right, it begs the question of morality. You know, if that’s what you have to do to survive, you have to, how is that right or wrong?

And it is, you know, he, it’s appealing. Ives, you know, kind of tells his story that he had tuberculosis, he had these terrible headaches, he was getting ready to go to a sanatorium to just convalesce and die. But then he talked to this Indian guide or shaman or something who told him this thing about the Wendigo and he thought, Well, gosh, yeah, that, that, I ought to give that a try.

So he ate the shaman. I 

Todd: tried him first. 

Craig: And he said, and it worked. He said, my tuberculosis went away, I feel great. He said, before this I was depressed. He’s like, now I’m happy. Everything’s 

Todd: good. I ate five people. More better than before. 

Craig: And it is seductive, especially for someone who is Suffering because, you know, they are having these ravenous cravings and, and, uh, aren’t succumbing to them.

Todd: Yeah. Yeah. He’s really in over his head and he really is kind of at a point of no return, although he’s not ready to admit it to himself yet. He’d still has that morality holding him back. Mm hmm. Yeah. Uh, so yeah, and you’re right, it does call into question, well, what is that morality really? Even 

Craig: though we see, like, he has in his mind fantasies, like, he fantasizes about killing David Arquette’s character.

Um, and I assumed it was a fantasy, but the movie plays it like, maybe it’s really happening, and then it cuts back, and we see that it’s not really happening. Yeah. But, because he cut, uh, Ives, The other people at the post, Knox, puts him under arrest and they tie him up. And then, it’s, it’s, it’s really funny, um, Ive starts making this stew.

Like he’s chopping carrots and onions and things and he’s Throwing him in this huge cauldron. 

Todd: It’s, it’s so cute. It’s sort of a take off of old school. I’m talking like 1930s, 40s style cannibal movies. 

Craig: Where there’s a giant pot. Right, the natives boiling you in it. And Nox says something like What are you, cooking?

It’s, uh, stew. You need any help? No, no, though, uh, perhaps later you might contribute. 

Todd: You let me know.

That’s so good. Martha is going around, she’s investigating, and she discovers the horses have been slaughtered. And? And then walks to the window and looks in at Boyd. Boyd is trying to communicate with her and blood drops onto her face. And Arquette’s character, Cleaves, is dead too and on the roof. So he’s been killed.

Kind of mangled. He’s been killed and they believe that it’s him. Boyd. Right. Who’s done this and that’s why they’ve 

Craig: tied him up. They send Martha away, right? Like Martha has to go get some 

Todd: general. Right, they’re gonna basically get a general to arrest Boyd. And take him to prison. And take him to prison.

So, you can tell that he’s whittling down the ranks, but you’re also left with this nagging question and that is that Boyd has been watching him this whole time. We’ve known where he is. Is he really that supernatural that he’s killed these horses and this guy without, in some way, without us 

Craig: knowing?

Right. And, and Boyd, he asks, he says, How did you do it? You know, I was watching you the whole time. And this was another twist that I didn’t see coming. Oh yeah, 

Todd: nobody would. Yeah, from a mile away. Uh, the doctor guy, I mean, it’s really, it’s just the doctor, Boyd, and Ives. Ives at this point. He says, Hey, have you seen my sword?

It’s missing from over the top. And I love that shot where in the background, there are the two swords crossed over the mantle, but where the one sword’s supposed to be, it’s like a wall is just a little cleaner. Like, okay, could it be more obvious? Right. Uh, and he says, Hey, where’s my sword? Oh, I don’t know.

I didn’t take your sword. And he walks into another room and then there’s a figure there with the sword. Nox looks up and goes, Oh, my word, you make some exclamation. And at that point, the figure cuts him down with the sword. And then what do we see next? The door opens into where Boyd is staying and in walks Colonel 

Craig: Hart.

Yeah, looking healthier than ever. Yeah, vibrant. And the last time that we had seen him, I mean, not only had Ives stabbed him in the gut, but like he had pulled it up, like he was gutting him. And the last time we had seen him, he was still alive. But, like, he was bleeding profusely from the mouth, and, um, there was no question in your mind that he was gonna die.

Yes, but he explains he says, you know, I I thought I was gonna die I was feeling panic knowing that my life was slipping away and then I blacked out and when I woke up Ives was feeding me and at that point it was the point of no return. I was feeling better I had I had no choice but to go along with it.

And so now the two of them have 

Todd: been working together Yeah, now I felt great. And so you’re kind of wondering what’s gonna happen to him. He basically tells him So you’re going to kill me. No, 

Craig: no, no. It’s lonely being accountable. Tough making friends.

And he, you know, like I said, I, Jeffrey Jones, he can deliver lines like that and it’s completely straight way. And they’re still so funny. Yes. I laughed out loud 

Todd: at that part. It’s great. So their idea is that they’re basically going to feed him, uh, the body of Knox essentially, and probably, um, um, Cuck.

Probably Cleaves as well, whoever they put in this stew. Right. And so all three of them are in the room, and they’re sitting there and trying to get him to eat the stew. Well, 

Craig: before that, Ives is again trying to convince Boyd, you know, We’re just gonna be our own little community, and you know that Oh, that’s right.

When the summertime comes, you know, the gold rush is gonna come through, and people are gonna be coming straight through here all the time, and, um, Of course we’ll kill, we have to kill, but we’ll be selective, and we don’t wanna break up things. families and things. Um, join us. And boy basically says, no, I, I’m not going to.

And so I’ve stabs him. And he basically says, that doesn’t have to be a mortal wound. You know what you have to do if you want to live. And so then they all sit, they sit him down and they sit around the two other men start eating the stew. And again, heart says, isn’t this civilized?

Todd: So 

Craig: funny. Yeah. But basically, Again, um, Ives just keeps saying, You know what you have to do if you want to live. Boyd is really bleeding, I mean, you see the blood just flowing from his wound. And so he eats. 

Todd: Yep, and it isn’t easy for him. He’s really struggling with it, but he does eat. And Guy Pearce is a vegetarian, so it was also pretty hard for the actor himself.

Um, my understanding is that he was spitting out, uh, the meat between takes, but the stew looked really good. 

Craig: It did look really good. That’s kind of another odd side effect, I guess, of this vampirism, is that once they have, once they’ve tasted human flesh, then they are kind of disgusted by animal flesh.

There’s a 

Todd: comment made earlier about that. Yeah, 

Craig: I’ve said, like. Somebody offered him some ribs. Right. And they say, don’t you eat meat? And he says, no, I can’t help but always remember that it was an animal. Um, which sounds like, you know, a very vegan kind of thing, but it’s more, I think what he means is that’s gross.

Like, you know, I, now that I’ve had the good stuff, I’m not going to go back to gross animals. Animal, yeah. 

Todd: So he does eat and, uh, gets a little better, but they’ve still got him tied up, uh, cause they’re not sure they can trust him. Colonel Hart comes in and has some discussion 

Craig: with him. Yeah, and this is where I really felt, I knew that the movie was coming to an end.

And I kind of felt like the ending was rushed a little 

Todd: bit. I do too. This scene here was the part that, if I was going to criticize this film, I thought this scene didn’t make a lot of sense. Or if it did, it wasn’t set up 

Craig: properly. Well, it’s like, you know, Hart is trying to convince Boyd, join us, be with us, you know, you have to kill people, that’s it.

And then Boyd says, Let me go, I’m gonna kill him, and Hart does let him go, and says, Okay, but before you kill him, you have to kill me, I can’t live like this anymore. It’s like it took no convincing at all. Yeah, 

Todd: for him to have this turn of heart. It’s very strange that he could go through and he could kill Knox, he could do all this stuff, but now suddenly he feels like it’s gone too far in some 

Craig: way.

Right, it’s like 

Todd: And he didn’t come It happened too 

Craig: quickly. And there’s some point where he’s like carrying the remains of the bones out to like throw in the trash or whatever and like he’s he doesn’t seem to be bothered by it at all. He’s very nonchalant, yes. Yeah. So it’s kind of an odd situation. And quick change of character where he says, Oh, please kill me.

I can’t, I can’t live like this anymore. It kind of comes out of left field. It does. 

Todd: Yeah, that’s pretty weak, but he kills him. And then that begins the final battle where, uh, Ives comes in. Uh, by the way, Ives has been up on the, uh, in one of the towers with his binocular, with his, uh, telescope. And he’s seen the.

company coming back, the people that they basically sent for. The general, right? The general is like, ah, breakfast, lunch, and supplies. But they must be really far away. I know. Really slow. Are they stopped for a bite on the way or something like that? Because 

Craig: they don’t seem to be that far away. Like he can see them with his blind eye.

And they’re on horseback, so it’s not like they’re just walking, but 

Todd: whatever. Somebody must have stumbled, or you know, they had to stop and deal with something, who knows. Anyway, there’s this really long, protracted battle scene where they just beat the crap out of each other. And this is part of the dark comedy, you know, to my mind anyway, is it gets a little more and more ridiculous as they’re going around fighting.

Somebody stabbed somebody a few times and somebody said like a pitchfork and then, uh, they’re whacking each other with wood and with cutting his arm with an ax and the big, eventually, um, Boyd gets out and Ives is what looks like maybe out for the count and he drops the whole roof of this shed on him and walks into another room where we had previously seen they were big bear traps.

And of course Ives breaks out from underneath the wood, runs in there and they have this little moment again. Another one of those erotic tension scenes where they’re face to face and shoulder to shoulder and Boyd just grabs him and Flips him down on the ground and puts them both into a giant bear trap like for the largest bear in the world.

Yeah 

Craig: Yeah, and so they’re pinned there Boyd on top of, uh, Ives. I mean, it couldn’t really get, you know, this, this couldn’t have been unintentional. Um, I also, uh, read that, uh, initially this scene was intended to take place, the last battle was intended to take place on the rooftops of the, the buildings, uh, in where they are.

At night. At night, right, while the whole thing was going up in flames. Oof. They just decided at the last minute, no, let’s just beat the crap out of each other. And they choreographed it themselves and, uh, and it’s, it’s It’s, it’s interesting that that’s the way that they ended 

Todd: up. Yeah, it is. And there’s still a little bit of humor in there.

That was really sneaky. Yeah. Right. As he, but as his dying breath is coming, I’ve says, so if you die first, I’m going to eat you. But if I die first, you’re going to have to ask yourself, are you going to eat me? Yeah. Bon Appetit. Right. 

Craig: And then, uh, he does die first, Ives does. And I’m wondering, you know, uh, the, oh, and more humor.

Martha and the general do arrive and the general’s looking around and he finds the stew, um, and he smells it and he smells it and it smells good. And then he eats it. And of course we know that now he’s infected or whatever. It’s inconsequential. It’s, it’s kind of just, you know, something a little silly there at the end.

One of those cute 

Todd: moments where this will continue on. 

Craig: Right. And then Martha, I thought this was funny too. Martha opens the door and sees, um, Ives dead and Boyd dying and she turns around and just like, And I’m done with this. And she just leaves. Like she just walks out of the encampment altogether. She sure does.

And I really wondered if Boyd was going to eat him. And I wouldn’t have been surprised either way. But he doesn’t. He 

Todd: doesn’t. He chooses that path to end it here. Yeah, 

Craig: and that kind of calls back, you know, the very, very first thing that we see before we even see any actors, um, on a black screen, there’s a quote from Nietzsche, um, and I, I was writing it down quickly, so it may not be word for word, but, um, it was something like, He that fights with monsters.

should see that he doesn’t become a monster himself. Um, and that’s kind of the defining moment here at the end. You know, he’s battled this monster, he’s won. Does he die honorably or does he save himself, you know, by eating? And he chooses, I guess. What we’re supposed to see as the nobler option. 

Todd: Yeah, I, I, I love this film.

Uh, my understanding is that the film was beset with quite a few production problems, considerable production problems, uh, as it started out for the first few weeks of filming, um, had a lot of turnover, had a lot of rewrites done. It’s. It’s good that a good film came out of that process. Normally it’s not, but there was a change in director on the screenwriter.

Ted Griffith actually went on to do Ocean’s 11 after this, he wrote that. So, uh, but not much else afterwards. Antonio Bird, who came in to direct it, she hasn’t done a whole lot recognizable. She’s done some TV work. I think she’s doing some work on the village right now and stuff like that. Just a diamond in the rough, as far as I’m concerned of horror films, uh, not super famous people working on it.

Lots of famous people in the parts, but no Tom Cruises or anything, 

Craig: right? And that was, again, I’m a little bit surprised because virtually all of these actors are actors that you’re going to recognize. So I’m a little bit surprised that it, even though like you said, there’s not that, you know, Brad Pitt, Tom Cruise, the big blockbuster name.

I mean, these are quality working actors here. So yeah, it’s a little bit surprising. 

Todd: Yeah, I love it. I love this movie to death. I love watching it a lot. I love introducing people to it because it is so unusual and You’re right, it is at its heart a vampire movie. Um, but it does try to put a cannibal type twist on it.

And we were talking earlier, seeing a couple cannibal films, about how you can’t really do much with the cannibal genre. Right. And here’s a spot where at least if you don’t make the cannibals native tribes out in some wilderness, uh, you can cannibalism, mixing it with, uh, In this case, you know, vampirism or something else, right?

Craig: Well, and I think that that’s, you know, a really unique and interesting thing that this movie does is that really at its core, it is a vampire movie, but the word vampire is never spoken. It’s almost as though, you know, these people just don’t even recognize that lore. You know, it’s the same kind of thing.

They just attribute it to something else. And that’s creative. I mean, it would have been. Very easy to just say, okay, they’re vampires, but they, they tweaked it a little bit and that’s, that’s creative. And I appreciate uniqueness in horror films. Isn’t this the 

Todd: second movie too we’ve seen that had the Wendigo legend?

Yeah. 

Craig: We talked about Pet Sematary a week or two ago and it’s not really, uh, expressed in the movie so much. They explore it more in the book, but yeah, I’ve, I’ve heard of that legend. In lots of places both in fiction and nonfiction. So it’s an interesting lore to pull from. Yeah, I liked it Todd You know, frankly, like I said, I wasn’t really looking forward to it I picked the last couple so I wanted you to have complete freedom of what we chose and I I just thought You know old fashioned war movie But I really liked it, and I would watch it again.

I probably will watch it again. So, 

Todd: thanks! You’re welcome, and you know, if you really did like it, I’m telling you, those, if you get the DVD, those commentaries are really 

Craig: quite good. Yeah, I heard there were deleted scenes, too. Did you 

Todd: There are some, yeah. I don’t remember, but yeah, 

Craig: there were. Yeah, I read that, um Well, and this isn’t any expert, you know, this is just comment boards, but, uh, people said that the, uh, the deleted scenes are, are really quite good, and they actually give some more backstory into, um, some of the other characters like Rike, um, and I guess it kind of explains why Rike has such hostility towards Boyd, which you do see in the movie, but it’s not really explained, um, and somebody, you know, there’s more homoerotic and stuff to, um, what I read.

And again, I, this isn’t coming from an authority, but I read that they cut it just for time. Um, they wanted it to have no longer than a hundred minute runtime. And so they had to leave some things on the 

Todd: floor when you’re right. And as a result, the movie, as you said, moves, it does. It really 

Craig: does. It’s not a boring movie.

And we had been watching it for, I think, Almost an hour, like I looked at my watch and it had been like 50 minutes and I was like, holy crap, it feels like we’ve only been watching this for like 20 minutes. Like it does, it’s, it doesn’t feel like it’s not a long movie, but it certainly doesn’t feel like one.

It keeps moving. The story keeps progressing. Well, I 

Todd: think we’re almost half an hour into the movie before Boyd even utters a word. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, but you don’t notice. Right. Well, thank you again for listening. If you enjoyed this podcast, please share it with a friend. Like us on Facebook. We’re on Stitcher and iTunes if you want to subscribe to us.

Leave us a note somewhere. Tell us what you think and give us some suggestions of other films to watch. Until next week, I’m Todd. And I’m Craig. With Two Guys and a Chainsaw.